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TuanHA Rogue - The Ultimate Experience
- Thread starter tuanha
- Start date
superconnard
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- Apr 17, 2013
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- 77
Yep vitalic CC is best for the moment, Tuanha make a great cc for Retpal, monk etc why for rogue?... because rogue customer is too low perhaps? i don't know but the rogue cc have no implcation by tuanha. So plz tuanha go rework this cc.
PLz jerem.y u said bullshit.
PLz jerem.y u said bullshit.
PQR is gone, Vitalic CC is for PQR...are people insane enough to still use PQR?
superconnard
New Member
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- Apr 17, 2013
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- 77
Yes vitalic come back so...
Arena's are a different beast. even the best routine will not guarantee a win. i did a few arena's and won 50% of them with this routine, but will not be focusing on arena play with the bot because that is a sure fire way to get banned. Blizzard doesn't mess around with bots in the rated arena system.
The only issue i have faced in easy mode BG's, rated and arena is it likes to target the opponents pet if they do something like ice block or anything that makes them immune or when you should peel off and go elsewhere until the spell wares off. In arena's thats a show stopper and a quick way to lose.
So to answer your question yes i did try it out in the arena's. did i OMG smash faceroll them absolutely not, but i still did better than i would have if i was actually handling the rotation and CC.
Also, you get what you get when it comes to arena, Honorbuddy doesn't actually even support arena at all and never will. That has been stated many times on the forum by many people including the developers. I don't even believe the meshes are there for them.
If people expect it to work, then it doesn't and they complain I'm sure they could just flip a switch and disable the bot in all arenas completely. They are saying it "might" work but if it doesn't oh well.
See THIS post http://www.thebuddyforum.com/honorbuddy-forum/honorbuddy-guides/108771-help-desk-3.html#post1253312
So while i understand your urge for a perfectly functioning Bot/Routine for competitive play, be aware that the rogue is most likely the most complicated class to do that on AND the owners at honorbuddy actually frown upon people that use the bot for that use and will remove anything that actually is made just for that purpose. But they usually turn a blind eye. I kind of agree with them tho, botting is fun as hell but i personally don't want arenas to become what AV has become.
The only issue i have faced in easy mode BG's, rated and arena is it likes to target the opponents pet if they do something like ice block or anything that makes them immune or when you should peel off and go elsewhere until the spell wares off. In arena's thats a show stopper and a quick way to lose.
So to answer your question yes i did try it out in the arena's. did i OMG smash faceroll them absolutely not, but i still did better than i would have if i was actually handling the rotation and CC.
Also, you get what you get when it comes to arena, Honorbuddy doesn't actually even support arena at all and never will. That has been stated many times on the forum by many people including the developers. I don't even believe the meshes are there for them.
If people expect it to work, then it doesn't and they complain I'm sure they could just flip a switch and disable the bot in all arenas completely. They are saying it "might" work but if it doesn't oh well.
See THIS post http://www.thebuddyforum.com/honorbuddy-forum/honorbuddy-guides/108771-help-desk-3.html#post1253312
So while i understand your urge for a perfectly functioning Bot/Routine for competitive play, be aware that the rogue is most likely the most complicated class to do that on AND the owners at honorbuddy actually frown upon people that use the bot for that use and will remove anything that actually is made just for that purpose. But they usually turn a blind eye. I kind of agree with them tho, botting is fun as hell but i personally don't want arenas to become what AV has become.
drdominican
New Member
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- Feb 26, 2011
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- 86
And still no word from Tuanha - I hope that another developer comes along. when you are the only game in town you have the customers by the nutsack
tuanha
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 29, 2011
- Messages
- 6,998
Hi, rogue is more complicated than I thought on PvP and I need 2 more day.
For PvE i think it doing good dps as I've test with all 3 spec and the result are close to Simcraft.
drdominican
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- Feb 26, 2011
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A lot of us where not looking for a wave of the hand and it be fixed, just that you where aware and that you where working on it. the fact that you have now told us the above satisfies me in knowing that you are aware and will plan on working on it,
Thanks
Ginsterinator
New Member
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- Jun 14, 2012
- Messages
- 14
A couple of *must have* changes for the PvE profile as far as the combat spec go are as follows: -
1) The routine lets revealing drop when +1 mobs are detected (i.e. Blade Flurry goes up) and is only refreshed the second you only have one target this is quite the DPS lost on a majority of fights.
2) Not sure the current amount required for FoK but maybe you could include these options in the config - it needs to be equal to or higher than 7.
3) Crimson Tempest needs to be when equal to or higher than 5, at the moment I see it go off when 3 targets are detected, and refreshed - another fairly substantial loss.
4) Single Target: Rupture Usage. Needs to stop being casted entirely when under the effects of 'Time Warp', 'Heroism' or 'Bloodlust'.
5) Single Target: Rupture Usage. Shouldn't be refreshed before it drops, at the moment it's being refreshed under 3 seconds or thereabouts.
Subtlety
I play sub in the top % of heroic raiders so I'll see how that plays out soon, haven't tested yet.
General Rambling
The question that a lot of people will be confused about that we could use some clarity on Tuanha is what changes will be on the free profile and what will be on the paid. We currently have no idea and since editing routines is relatively awkward (at least at first glance moving / comparing from PQR) 'advanced logic' doesn't really tell us anything.
I look forward to seeing what changes you may bring. I've recently tried some of the other bots Wrobot, Noobbot, Crawler since the 'detection' of PQR and made a really in depth sub profile over on Wrobot. Sadly, none of them are fast enough whatsoever (Wrobot as well), there's considerable DPS loss in all of them simply because most of the time no matter what frame lock fps settings are performance your PC churns out they just simply don't process the rotation fast enough. PQR was and still is perfect. Comparing them side by side says it all.
Honorbuddy is reputable as a bot but it's never had golden, perfect and precise routines probably due to the coding I assume and currently rouges don't seem to have a single rotation that does the basics. I'm referring to PureRotation, FightThisWay, Singular, YourRaidingBuddy. All of them are broken in one way or another but this seems the best of the bunch albeit some tweaks needed here and there.
Anyway, let us know if you care to update this and to what extent and I can give you some exact specifics as to what the sub pve profile needs based on actual play as opposed to just sites/statistics.
1) The routine lets revealing drop when +1 mobs are detected (i.e. Blade Flurry goes up) and is only refreshed the second you only have one target this is quite the DPS lost on a majority of fights.
2) Not sure the current amount required for FoK but maybe you could include these options in the config - it needs to be equal to or higher than 7.
3) Crimson Tempest needs to be when equal to or higher than 5, at the moment I see it go off when 3 targets are detected, and refreshed - another fairly substantial loss.
4) Single Target: Rupture Usage. Needs to stop being casted entirely when under the effects of 'Time Warp', 'Heroism' or 'Bloodlust'.
5) Single Target: Rupture Usage. Shouldn't be refreshed before it drops, at the moment it's being refreshed under 3 seconds or thereabouts.
Subtlety
I play sub in the top % of heroic raiders so I'll see how that plays out soon, haven't tested yet.
General Rambling
The question that a lot of people will be confused about that we could use some clarity on Tuanha is what changes will be on the free profile and what will be on the paid. We currently have no idea and since editing routines is relatively awkward (at least at first glance moving / comparing from PQR) 'advanced logic' doesn't really tell us anything.
I look forward to seeing what changes you may bring. I've recently tried some of the other bots Wrobot, Noobbot, Crawler since the 'detection' of PQR and made a really in depth sub profile over on Wrobot. Sadly, none of them are fast enough whatsoever (Wrobot as well), there's considerable DPS loss in all of them simply because most of the time no matter what frame lock fps settings are performance your PC churns out they just simply don't process the rotation fast enough. PQR was and still is perfect. Comparing them side by side says it all.
Honorbuddy is reputable as a bot but it's never had golden, perfect and precise routines probably due to the coding I assume and currently rouges don't seem to have a single rotation that does the basics. I'm referring to PureRotation, FightThisWay, Singular, YourRaidingBuddy. All of them are broken in one way or another but this seems the best of the bunch albeit some tweaks needed here and there.
Anyway, let us know if you care to update this and to what extent and I can give you some exact specifics as to what the sub pve profile needs based on actual play as opposed to just sites/statistics.
steelrainkilla
New Member
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2012
- Messages
- 89
My buddy didnt know why he got baned when prq banwave hit. We both got 72hr suspention. We were on vent he said he was using it and i told him to stop, thats why he got baned. He used it for only 10 mins. Two weeks later he got a perma ban for using bot on the 28th, the day he used it and I told him to stop.
Ginsterinator
New Member
- Joined
- Jun 14, 2012
- Messages
- 14
Can we have some clarity on the highlighted parts please? You liked my post but haven't commented on it.
Finally someone from PQR! Now hopefully we get a good FREE rogue routine.
Wow hope this healps the Rogues using HB ... Tyvm
starlite68
Member
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- Oct 30, 2013
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- 307
You seem to mean well and I'd like to give some input. This tuanha routine is a literal piece of shit, always has been, and it won't change, and the paid routine is not ANY better than the free one for gaining rating. trying to help the author is a waste of time since A) there is no way he actually understands how to play rogue at high level in pvp or pve and B) he's busy with numerous other class CRs and his one and only goal is to sell his paid profiles from his website. I mean if you do PVP you can instantly tell how ludicrous his entire set up - yeah lets vanish or evade when HP < X% or if targeted by >2, etc. it's a joke. no small tweaks can fix the overall uselessness of this thing in anything other than unrated BGs.
As for PVE take another look at YourRaidingBuddy. THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH IT. it's by far the best raiding CR for rogues. it will no longer be updated till WoD but it's the one to use for now, and you can make small tweaks in the routine quite easily. The way to use it in hardmode raids is with hotkeys not full auto, and to manually decide when to toggle BF, AoE, cooldowns etc.
obviously you can't use singular for raiding and purerotation is OK but hasn't had any rogue changes for months and as far as i know never will... like i don't think it STILL casts rupture as combat, and that bug has been there forever.
point is, you are wasting time if you expect this CR to actually improve enough for high-end raiding or arenas. never happening, not with this author
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So what you are saying is this cc sucks, all the other cc's suck, yourraidingbuddy is ok. But they all suck for rated pvp and expecting any different is a lost cause. Well for Arena/RBG you are kind of correct. As for PVE your misinformed.
Last i checked yourraidingbuddy didn't work quite right in pve, and the AOE was completely borked. It also has absolutely no pvp support whatsoever, it just doesn't do anything.... I have tried that one also and this one gets me closest to simcraft or shadowcraft single target PVE.
Another thing you arent quite understanding is the fact that the owners of honorbuddy itself do not want you using it for Arenas/RBG's. Think that could be one of the main reasons there are no awesome faceroll arena CC's?
See http://www.thebuddyforum.com/honorbuddy-forum/combat-routines/rogue/119964-public-release-tuanha-rogue-ultimate-experience-155.html#post1416056
And I'm sorry if I have wrong information, but doesn't the OP state clearly this routine has "limited PVP support"
So lets go over this again, you seem to be mad about
1. There is something wrong with all the CC's for Arena/RBG even tho the bot itself doesn't support them.
2. This author's CC isn't up to par because unsupported PVP is broken and you think it sucks for PVE even tho it pulls the same numbers as a character sim.
You seem to want Honorbuddy to do something it will never focus on, and get pissed at all the routine creators for not being able to magically make Honorbuddy do something the bot wasn't even designed to do.....
I went into this routine knowing all that, and am still happy and doing "High End" Raiding without a hitch. It sounds like you are a little misinformed on what the bot is actually capable of, and raging at your own ignorance.
So yes, if anyone is looking for this routine to do something it cant, or it to make honorbuddy instantly awesome in Arena/RBG even tho its not supposed to by the owners request. You are wasting your time waiting for Honorbuddy to become something its not.
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starlite68
Member
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2013
- Messages
- 307
Not sure how this devolved into detailed literary criticism of my post, but my point was very simple and directed at the guy wanting to help improve the routine. point being this is the wrong CR for this, since the author *clearly* has no clue how to play a rogue in hardmode progression raids. making this thing work on par with what's already out there (eg yourraidingbuddy) is going to take a lot more than a few tweaks, it'll take rewriting the whole thing which tuanha is not capable of doing.
as for that theory pvp is not supported by this CR or HB is not supposed to be used in arenas... quote from Tuanha on his website:
"Combat Routine also help you become the Best Killer in any Battleground and Arena with advanced PvP logic."
No, no it won't. setting this thing up with its "advanced" features like "Dismantle if targeted by >X unit" is going to get you lower ratings than just going into arenas with singular set to default and clicking on the nearest enemy.
i kind of suspect j.remey is trolling becuase 5 min observing this routine at work, for example as combat spec, shows it's hilariously off any semblance of what a top raider or simcraft would use. the thing killing sprees in the middle of AR/SB with 100 energy for christ's sake. those having issues with yourraidingbuddy DONT expect it to magically use aoe properly or not kill you by trying to KS at the wrong time. if you are in a serious raid, press AR/SB and KS manually when it's appropriate, BF manually when more than 1 target, etc, same for the other specs. It absolutely runs the proper basic rotation for you, including fairly advanced stuff like keeping track of BG stacks and using anticipation appropriately, etc.
right now on a dummy im getting 270K dps sustained with yourraidingbuddy combat, and barely 200K with this routine, to give some perspective.
as for that theory pvp is not supported by this CR or HB is not supposed to be used in arenas... quote from Tuanha on his website:
"Combat Routine also help you become the Best Killer in any Battleground and Arena with advanced PvP logic."
No, no it won't. setting this thing up with its "advanced" features like "Dismantle if targeted by >X unit" is going to get you lower ratings than just going into arenas with singular set to default and clicking on the nearest enemy.
i kind of suspect j.remey is trolling becuase 5 min observing this routine at work, for example as combat spec, shows it's hilariously off any semblance of what a top raider or simcraft would use. the thing killing sprees in the middle of AR/SB with 100 energy for christ's sake. those having issues with yourraidingbuddy DONT expect it to magically use aoe properly or not kill you by trying to KS at the wrong time. if you are in a serious raid, press AR/SB and KS manually when it's appropriate, BF manually when more than 1 target, etc, same for the other specs. It absolutely runs the proper basic rotation for you, including fairly advanced stuff like keeping track of BG stacks and using anticipation appropriately, etc.
right now on a dummy im getting 270K dps sustained with yourraidingbuddy combat, and barely 200K with this routine, to give some perspective.
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Did I at all say you should do top tier raiding at all AFK with any routine? You should always control your own cooldowns, ALWAYS.
So what you are complaining about is that it is doing the rotation perfectly but firing off killing spree and other cooldowns that are getting you killed? All while stating you should run the cooldowns manually anyway?
Then you go off about how the people that use yourraidingbuddy don't expect that routine to not magically fire off cooldowns at the wrong time..... argh
The other question I have is who exactly uses a target dummy for an accurate DPS reading? They are notoriously bad for that. Take that into account also that you may or may not be configuring the routine completely wrong and trying to interfere with it while its going. If your trying to cast things when its going ham it auto pauses and hands you control of the character, which would result in a severe dps loss if you dont realize its hapening.
And now I'm a troll for stating my opinion on how the routine works for me and quoting what a core developer stated about Arenas/RBG's? Now your really reaching.
On a side note if you are sustaining 270k dps on a target dummy and you think that is good, then you really shouldn't be commenting on "Top Tier" raiding, as that is about average for "Normal Tier" raiding.
Who is the real "troll" here? Im saying that in all the boss fights i do with this routine configured correctly it comes damn near the projected realistic DPS numbers, and your saying the other routine does 70k more than this one all tested on a target dummy.
I have tried yourraidingbuddy and it did well in single target situations when you just had to stand still,It didnt do any better/worse than Tauhna's but it doesnt do any movement, facing or targeting. Pair that with AOE not functioning at all, and well i just dont get what your trying to say.
The OP of that thread states coming soon but you say it wont be updated until WoD....
Lastly i don't understand why you continue to bash Tauhna about not knowing how to play the rogue at all, I'm sure he does but even if he didn't you don't need to know how to play the class in order to code a routine. He is going off simulations I'm pretty sure, when running this routine i also run spellflash and it fires off all the spells when the buttons light up so its doing the rotation correctly.
So what you are complaining about is that it is doing the rotation perfectly but firing off killing spree and other cooldowns that are getting you killed? All while stating you should run the cooldowns manually anyway?
Then you go off about how the people that use yourraidingbuddy don't expect that routine to not magically fire off cooldowns at the wrong time..... argh
The other question I have is who exactly uses a target dummy for an accurate DPS reading? They are notoriously bad for that. Take that into account also that you may or may not be configuring the routine completely wrong and trying to interfere with it while its going. If your trying to cast things when its going ham it auto pauses and hands you control of the character, which would result in a severe dps loss if you dont realize its hapening.
And now I'm a troll for stating my opinion on how the routine works for me and quoting what a core developer stated about Arenas/RBG's? Now your really reaching.
On a side note if you are sustaining 270k dps on a target dummy and you think that is good, then you really shouldn't be commenting on "Top Tier" raiding, as that is about average for "Normal Tier" raiding.
Who is the real "troll" here? Im saying that in all the boss fights i do with this routine configured correctly it comes damn near the projected realistic DPS numbers, and your saying the other routine does 70k more than this one all tested on a target dummy.
I have tried yourraidingbuddy and it did well in single target situations when you just had to stand still,It didnt do any better/worse than Tauhna's but it doesnt do any movement, facing or targeting. Pair that with AOE not functioning at all, and well i just dont get what your trying to say.
The OP of that thread states coming soon but you say it wont be updated until WoD....
Lastly i don't understand why you continue to bash Tauhna about not knowing how to play the rogue at all, I'm sure he does but even if he didn't you don't need to know how to play the class in order to code a routine. He is going off simulations I'm pretty sure, when running this routine i also run spellflash and it fires off all the spells when the buttons light up so its doing the rotation correctly.
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im just praying that this routine will be as good as the other routines when WoD has been released.
i personally dont expect a major update from tuanha before WoD tho, cause from the beta tester feedback, we know, that there has been a lot of changes regarding cc. - and why should tuanha spend hours perfecting this routine when he'd have to delete half of the code when WoD is released~
i personally dont expect a major update from tuanha before WoD tho, cause from the beta tester feedback, we know, that there has been a lot of changes regarding cc. - and why should tuanha spend hours perfecting this routine when he'd have to delete half of the code when WoD is released~