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TuanHA Death Knight- The Ultimate Experience
- Thread starter tuanha
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lawrence131
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i've played around with both rotation types up to 2k manually, and there's a time for each of them. giving options in the CR would be nice.
if you are fighting a melee cleave such as TSG, you can have potentially 100% uptime on both dps targets the highest possible Dot stack as well as doing more single target dmg throughout the fight. The 100x spam dispels are also minimally useful against some of these types of comps, and your kill target is very unlikely to kite you for a significant portion of the fight. for this style fight i would say tuanha's current festerblight type of style is vastly superior - more single target dmg and way higher total dmg with no one kiting you and not much to dispel.
i've gone the other extreme to use a purely icy/boil rotation and even changed to chillblains against resto druid teams when we decide to ride the druid the whole match. this is also shockingly effective as you are constantly dispelling hots and he is re-snared within seconds every form change to break snare/root. this is the extreme opposite style and yet much more effective for some comps to use the icy rotation.
so i wouldn't conclude that the current rotations is always bad, if you could add an option to go back and forth between the two or even hotkey it on the fly that would be perfect. if you want the CR to auto-everything, let it pick rotation based on target class. IMO icy/boil rotation is better if you're killing a druid, mage, priest, hunter (any class that can kite you well or have a lot of important things to spam dispel). against melee i personally like fester-style more.
tuanha
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Thank, I've tweak rotation base on class that can kite.
Good news is I have very good feed back on damage with the new bust logic (activate burst on attack power increase - for example my dk have 51k dmg, with trinket, weapon enchant proc... it jump up to 90k and CR start bursting and it doing INSANE damage)
I'll update DK to svn when all thing work fine.
Guys,
few days ago AMD released Catalyst 14.4, primary focused on frame stuttering fix.
All modern Radeon families had this problem and now dropped frames gone.
Strongly recommended to update, HB works like a charm now.
I think, all whining about freq FPS drop while framelock ON, has directly depends on DPC latency.
Spent the whole day, removing all DPC latency spikes and now HB runs much smoother and DPS increased quite good.
few days ago AMD released Catalyst 14.4, primary focused on frame stuttering fix.
All modern Radeon families had this problem and now dropped frames gone.
Strongly recommended to update, HB works like a charm now.
I think, all whining about freq FPS drop while framelock ON, has directly depends on DPC latency.
Spent the whole day, removing all DPC latency spikes and now HB runs much smoother and DPS increased quite good.
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Tuanha, the fact you are responding and aware is good enough. Thanks for your effort, and outstanding CRs.
I've played with the rotation to 2200 last season in multiple brackets, and I've done it again this season in multiple brackets so it's not that I can't play with it I just know that it can be improved.
In regards to your point on the comp you're up against even running the current fester-blight rotation is just not good. The way it plays out in arena is that you're using Chains of Ice pretty often which just screws with the whole fester rotation of the bat, the fester blight rotation is something that PvE players use because they never need to use chains of ice and to a lesser extent blood boil/blood strike. Therefore it works perfectly in PvE cos the two runes you need are always going to be up.
However this is not PvE. This is PvP and the way it works in PvP is that you are using chains of ice a hell of a lot, you're using blood boil a hell of a lot. Even against a TSG (heavy melee team) you are still using chains of ice often enuf to mess up the festerblight rotation. Warrior leaps, charges, intervenes, freedoms (windwalk, tigers lust etc), trinket or if you get cc'ed or snared then you end up using chains of ice ALOT. Now bare in mind I only covered the warriors abilities there, there are still two other classes in the arena that could be potential swaps and you'd need to use chains of ice on them. Now just think about that, Chains of Ice on its own is inherently giving TuanHa's current routine a problem its using the frost runes we need for Festering strike, now I've seen the routine use icy toych/blood strike and blood boil in between but I've also seen it wait upwards of 3-4 seconds to get the runes for festering strike in which time I've had to use the blood/frost runes for something else which in essence is losing dps.
And just a heads up, even against TSG the ONLY time you the glyph of Icy Touch would be useless is if they ran with a MW monk as healer. Any other healer gives the DK/Warrior important enuf buffs to warrant thier removal via the Glyph of Icy Touch. So all in all it's a pretty staple glyph that only gets changed in RARE occasions, and even when it gets changed there are often many times using Icy Touch would be better than Festering Strike. Remember melee range is only 5 yards.
Like I said this is my opinion after playing the Routine and the Class to 2.2k+ several times. This is also what I've seen and talked about with 2-3 Multi-Gladiator DK's.
TLDR: Give an option to take Festering Out or Put Festering in to our rotation.
What the point to leave chains on autocast? Use it youself!
Chains on target => OFF
Chains to save teamates => 25%
Glyphed Icy Touch can be improved with priority system, e.g.
=====
T1: urgent dispell, all enemies monitoring , allowed to use deathrunes and blood stacks if case matched
if Duration >= 3 ( Fearward:always, BoP:<=50%HP, Sacrifice:always, Innervate:<=60%MP, Freedom:range<=8 )
T2: urgent offensive glyph irrelevant, killing ranged totems, preventing stealth/drinking, killing Psyfiend
target in range <= 10, converting: free rune
T3: lazy dispell, enemies with Saves and Bursts
festering: not required, festering: range >= 10, festering: target immune, festering: player rooted || disarmed, converting: free rune
T4: forced dispell, dispelling Buffs and HoTs
no enemies in range <= 8, converting: free rune
T5: lazy offensive, glyph irrelevant
no enemies in range <= 8, converting: free rune
T6: forced defensive, acquire RP to heal with lichborne, heal with deathstrike
rune exists
===
Now it's a some kind of brainstorm mindmap and not well structured, sorry for laxity.
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woohah
Member
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- Jan 15, 2010
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- 153
Noticed some issues last night raiding heroic content:
1.) Bot doesn't use Dark Simulcrum at all. Whether I tell it to cast or on cooldown, it doesn't matter. I manually press it because i have the box ticked for it to automatically use the buff and that portion works.
A.) Why is this an issue? For fights there is a caster like on heroic Dark Shamans, when I am on the lower team and fighting Kardris, he casts Froststorm Bolt. I need to be able to DS this ability and use it as a HUUUGE dps gain. This is frost damage which is basically multiplied by me being frost specced.
2.) It appears in the logs that the bot is trying to use DS, however it thinks that howling blast is more important? I don't agree with the logic on this. Howling Blast is a castable ability that can be done after DS buff is used. Why scrap it?
Logs included:
Also, to all the guys complaining about how Tuan does his CR authentication. Of the times I have noticed it was down I have pinged him on the side to let him know. He has been on the spot about this and extremely helpful in the matter by getting up and fixing it almost immediately. I think we need to all understand that he is just 1 person and exercise a little patience from time to time.
1.) Bot doesn't use Dark Simulcrum at all. Whether I tell it to cast or on cooldown, it doesn't matter. I manually press it because i have the box ticked for it to automatically use the buff and that portion works.
A.) Why is this an issue? For fights there is a caster like on heroic Dark Shamans, when I am on the lower team and fighting Kardris, he casts Froststorm Bolt. I need to be able to DS this ability and use it as a HUUUGE dps gain. This is frost damage which is basically multiplied by me being frost specced.
2.) It appears in the logs that the bot is trying to use DS, however it thinks that howling blast is more important? I don't agree with the logic on this. Howling Blast is a castable ability that can be done after DS buff is used. Why scrap it?
Logs included:
Also, to all the guys complaining about how Tuan does his CR authentication. Of the times I have noticed it was down I have pinged him on the side to let him know. He has been on the spot about this and extremely helpful in the matter by getting up and fixing it almost immediately. I think we need to all understand that he is just 1 person and exercise a little patience from time to time.
Also, I have auto racial checked, but it has never used Will of the Forsaken.
Hey Tuanha,
Just to keep you reminded of it. Frost doesn't seem to function correctly, as it just spams howling blast. I know you say that it's working for you, so maybe you can tell us what you do/select when you switch to frost spec (This is for PvE/Raid, btw)?
EDIT: I just tried using it again and its near useless. I ether spam howling blast, or just stand there and do nothing. I have adjusted different settings, used different presets, turned framelock on (even tho it says off in the op)... it just doesn't work.
Thanks,
Just to keep you reminded of it. Frost doesn't seem to function correctly, as it just spams howling blast. I know you say that it's working for you, so maybe you can tell us what you do/select when you switch to frost spec (This is for PvE/Raid, btw)?
EDIT: I just tried using it again and its near useless. I ether spam howling blast, or just stand there and do nothing. I have adjusted different settings, used different presets, turned framelock on (even tho it says off in the op)... it just doesn't work.
Thanks,
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lawrence131
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- Mar 16, 2014
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no one's arguing that fester is BETTER, there's just situations for both. and all high ranked players should use both interchangeably. dispels are incredibly powerful and should be used frequently, my point was that you don't need to dispel 10x for each important buff that pops up which is what an exclusive icy rotation would do. using fester doesn't mean you can never chains or icy dispel anyone ever. i would say that if ur only going to let the bot full auto and you have to pick one or the other, 100% icy rotation is for sure better. being able to do both is still ideal.
the fact that there were multiple threads on this on arena junkies and MMOchampion shows that the answer isn't black and white. at any given time, if there's nothing to dispel and ur target is right next to you while you already have a high AP dot stack going, obviously spamming icy/boil is *not* better. at the same time, if you can't reach a target or someone just used divine plea cuz they're running OOM, spamming fester instead of icy is a horrible ideal.
this is why in this part of this thread and previously, i've commented that there should be priority logic for icy dispels and fester. even if the dispel ruins the whole rotation, uses up precious death runes, etc, sometimes it's so important it's still worth it.
so in short, if the CR can only do ONE style, i fully agree icy is better. if it can do both at the right times, then this is ideal. the more gladiators you talk to the more opinions you'll get, but i guarantee they do both. reinhart was one of the earlier ones pushing festerblight while at the same time others equally skilled and ranked were saying they don't even have fester on their action bars -- shows that either can work exclusively, or both can work even better together
Source?
woohah
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Myself. I helped Tuan test this. Dark Sim is confirmed working.
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Awesome. As long as the rotation gets fixed, I'll be stoked.