What's new
By:
  • Visit Rebornbuddy
  • Visit Panda Profiles
  • Visit LLamamMagic
  • Visit Resources
  • Visit Downloads
  • Visit Portal

Season 8 Haedrig - Best starter

boynextdoor said:
This season I think I'm going to use "the other bot" and start with swk into lon monk just because its not another season of sader. However, I'm still on the fence. I do love my easy xp.

Last season I started a week late and used autofollow to tail my friends DH (gave him one of my alts after he got banned) and was able to put together a shitty lon sader with mostly dex gear and in less than 3 days of leaching from a P700 dh I was up and running. Finished the season top 5 paragon NA.

If you only have one account, then suck it up and play barb at the start even if you don't like it. 3 days of manual barb will set you up for 3 months of waking up to 25 paragon and a stash page of ancient sader loot.
Click to expand...

I do think it's viable to start with a barb to get the IK set, then start to work it into another set while collecting LoN gear. This is obviously a more valuable play if you want to play in a group where you might also use the barb as a ZDPS. I spent a couple hundred hours messing around with WDs and WD based groups, I am probably going to avoid that class for this patch.

I am going to be honest... If there are no changes to the game in season 8, I am only going to play it for the stash tab and will just use my non seasonal characters for general botting.



In reference to the question about T13 rifts under 4 minutes: I was able to get this accomplishment for seasonal journey on both LTK monk and UE DH for all of my accounts. I have definitely done it in the past with LoN Sader.
 
TwoCigars said:
I do think it's viable to start with a barb to get the IK set, then start to work it into another set while collecting LoN gear. This is obviously a more valuable play if you want to play in a group where you might also use the barb as a ZDPS. I spent a couple hundred hours messing around with WDs and WD based groups, I am probably going to avoid that class for this patch.

I am going to be honest... If there are no changes to the game in season 8, I am only going to play it for the stash tab and will just use my non seasonal characters for general botting.



In reference to the question about T13 rifts under 4 minutes: I was able to get this accomplishment for seasonal journey on both LTK monk and UE DH for all of my accounts. I have definitely done it in the past with LoN Sader.
Click to expand...


I am having the same dilemma as some of the posters before. I can't decide which class to start with.
Btw, I only have 1 account so I would be playing manually for 2 days at the start of the season.
I started DB in season 7, one month after the season started so it was a pretty late start so to speak, so in a way I am glad there's a reset now.

So basically I did LON Bomb, it's super efficient and fast, no need to describe that as all of you know already. But the starting phase was a PITA when I had no gear and couldn't run high enough rift to quickly find the pieces.

The choices are as follows I guess:

1) Start crusader and find best available bombardment gear and just bot the level it can for couple days until it finds the ancient items for the paragon grind mode.
2) Start Barb and get the crusader items as described previously. (are 2 days enough to gear up the crusader? I can only play for the 2 days at season weekend)
3) Start monk and craft sunwuko LTK to grind low rifts and grifts (with no paragon lvls initially will this be a slow process for LTK sunwuko?) > bot the lon crusader items then turn DEX into STR for initial gear > bot crusader for better gear


My goal is eventually to get on leaderboard solo with either crusader or monk. For that purpose paragon farming is crucial. I think it's a must to get zmonk / zbarb in order to join 4 man for upgrading gems (at least lvl. 100?)
But LTK sunwuko needs paragon levels in order to run speed IMO, which wouldn't be a smart choice at the beginning of season.
BTW, the .668 Trinity is very nicely done for LTK monk, it's smooth with no dropping of wind stacks now.

Let me know what you old timers think.
 
ParagonBot said:
Let me know what you old timers think.
Click to expand...


I've had this dilemma for about a week now, started thinking about going crus from the start, but then realized that it would be boring and slow for the manual play. Then I thought about barb, which will probably be the most efficient way of getting a geared lon crus in the shortest time possible. But I want to play manual the first days and I don't think barb is that fun anymore. So there's wizard manual with vyr/tal'rash archon, that's fun and all, but yeah, no crusader gear.

I'm starting to really consider going wizard. Bot works good with vyr-archon, it will get into the ~~gr60 rifting very fast, and vyr/tal'rash archon is pretty tanky with quite good damage. But yeah, It may be the fastest start, but in the long run the barb choice into LoN is probably considerably better.
 
I haven't played manual at the start of a season since Season 1.

I always use the Seasonal Powerleveling communities.

Once a new season launches, I will get into the channels for leveling, post a message in each every 5 - 10 minutes and watch youtube while I wait. Once I get into a game, it doesn't take any attention to sit at the start of a Rift.

Season 2 I got some guy not geared for solo T4 trying to level 3 people at T6... It was worth the laughs since the other two guys kept dying trying to keep up with the leader, he would get pissed constantly. Season 3 was a pretty standard where I hit 70, said "thanks" and the leveler left the game. Season 4 there was a group of 3 DHs that dumped me every trash legendary they found. Season 5 the people actually helped me do haedrig requirements. Season 7, one person actually did a full set of bounties, took me to all the bosses, waited for me to get in town requirements until I had a full haedrig set.
 
I am a WD kinda guy always have been and always will be.

So main of course will be WD and will manually take him to 70 and get haedrig set first.
Will move into the firebats mode if gear drops in first 8 hours. Otherwise this starter WD is collecting HT/Garg gear like always.

My main goal this ladder season is to get last stash and my WD's will all get "65 gem", "75 tier Grift" && "45 tier no set" easily.

After that happens I level the 'meta' thus beginning 2nd phase of S8 and raise Grift tier over 80 with para for group in the 1500+ again.
 
iChoJo said:
Sooooo :) :)
What's everyone class for S8?
Click to expand...

I am using Monk since there is a specific Uliana's build build into the trinity BETA.

After a day I am already transitioned to a full LTK setup.
 
LON crus, paragon 721 and got gr 65 on 3-5 minute farm. Only missing ancient ingeom and a better amulet. Then it's mostly missing thorn rolls on gear & augments!
 
TwoCigars said:
I am using Monk since there is a specific Uliana's build build into the trinity BETA.

After a day I am already transitioned to a full LTK setup.
Click to expand...

How is LON LTK performing compared to LON crus? Only tried SWK LTK last season and it did pretty good.
 
qvazmir said:
How is LON LTK performing compared to LON crus? Only tried SWK LTK last season and it did pretty good.
Click to expand...

After I looked into a bunch of D3 Planners, looks like LoN monk isn't much better than standard really.
 
TwoCigars said:
After I looked into a bunch of D3 Planners, looks like LoN monk isn't much better than standard really.
Click to expand...

What do you mean by that? The bot performance isn't exactly related to the performance of the set. If the bot clears 75's really fast as LON monk ,it's good in my opinion. Doesn't really matter how high people push with it on leaderboards.
 
qvazmir said:
What do you mean by that?

The bot performance isn't exactly related to the performance of the set.

If the bot clears 75's really fast as LON monk ,it's good in my opinion. Doesn't really matter how high people push with it on leaderboards.
Click to expand...

I agree that bot performance isn't related to the performance of the set specifically. A build could be made in Trinity for LoN that would perform the skills just as efficiently.

The build for both will cast Gyana Na Kashu fireballs. You can't exact expect that they are always cast or that they always hit an enemy. So I have to go off of LTK damage...

I am simply pointing out that the LTK DPS is nearly 3 times higher using Sunwuko. The sustain is probably about the same. LoN build has more spirit available to cast LTK and has crowd control with Blinding Flash. Alternatively SWK has decoys that do 1000% damage for every sweeping wind stack.

Overall, I don't see it as being "better," which was implied by some of the information I have read about it.

I will elaborate on my own research into this so you can understand where I am coming from


This is the D3Planner provided for the LoN LTK Monk setup:
Diablo III Character Planner

At first glance I was blown away with the sheet damage as well as the actual LTK damage...
Then I started looking at the gear:

  • The Scarbringer has impossible stat rolls
  • All gear set to perfect rolls
  • 3000 paragon
  • Level 100 Caldessan's
  • Level 100 gems
  • All items and skill turned on that are not always on in game
  • Enemies set to specific type.

At this point I needed to address the comparison by creating a level playing field.


For theorycrafting purposes, I wanted to see the "Less Stack Management" build side by side.

My criteria to compare them was to match the following:
  • Paragon
  • All gem levels, types, Caldessan's
  • All item affix rolls set to maximum
  • No enemy specific settings
  • LTK, Mantra, Passives, Gems, Cube items turned on
  • LoN has Blinding Flash: Faith in the Light turned on. SWK Has Sweeping Wind turned on.
    • These skills are a direct swap in the builds due to the set bonus vs. no set bonus.
  • LoN has Lefebvre;s Soliloquy, Strongarm Bracers and Swampland Raiders and Sixth Sense Passive turned on
    • These are additional items that are available since it's not using a set, important for comparison.

[TABLE="width: 450, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"]S T A T[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]SWK Build:[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]LoN Build: [/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"]Damage[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]13,375,598[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]16,010,904[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"]Toughness[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1,000,116,803[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]852,260,020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"]Recovery[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]288,213,176[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]313,379,418[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"]Damage Multiplier[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]291.50%
Gems + Bastion's Will[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]2336.00%
Gems + LoN[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]
Effective DPS
Damage Per Second​
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]52,365,465[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]480,729,240[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]
Effective DPH
Damage Per Hit​
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]10,566,074[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]100,730,191[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"]S K I L L[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]SWK Build DPS:[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]LoN Build DPS: [/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"]Lashing Tailkick[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1,805,079,424,188[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]652,569,860,329[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"]Dashing Strike[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]54,732,266[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]372,701,706[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"]Cyclone Strike[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]N/A[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]262,905,798[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"]Sweeping Wind[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]219,934,953[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]N/A[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"]WotHF[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]120,453,249[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]N/A[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: right"]SWK Decoys[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1000% Weapon Damage
for each SW Stack[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]N/A[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]



LoN Benefits from replacing set item slots with Ancient Legendaries:
  • Hellfire Amulet [Allows Sixth Sense passive to be used but you would be hard pressed to get a perfectly rolled ancient one...],
  • Lefebvre's Soliloquy [up to 50% damage reduction for 5 seconds after Cyclone Strike],
  • Swamp Land Raiders [20% Fire Damage],
  • Cindercoat [20% Fire Damage, fire skill cost reduction],
  • Strongarm Bracers [up to 30% damage to enemies that have been knocked back, hit with cyclone strike, etc],
  • Burning Axe of Sankis [Fire Damage, 8% chance to "fight through pain" which is a 50% damage reduction for 5 seconds],
  • Obsidian Ring in cube instead of RRoG
  • Laws of Seph in cube [165 spirit when Blinding flash is cast],
  • Legacy of Nightmare's bonuses [1300% bonus damage, 52% damage reduction]

Fire damage has diminishing returns just like Dexterity, Crit, Attack Speed, etc.

SWK Benefits from
  • 50% damage reduction [Basically replaces LoN reduction bonus],
  • Crystal Fist [50% damage reduction for 6 seconds after Dashing Strike, basically replaces Burning Axe]
  • Spirit Guards [40% damage reduction, basically replaces Lefebvre's]
  • Decoys that deal 1000% weapon damage for each stack of Sweeping Wind you have active
  • Sweeping wind gives LTK 3000% weapon damage compared to the 1300% from LoN set.



Summary:
I am not saying that the LoN build isn't a viable build. It is something that people could definitely use. I can see where it might have more build in sustainability due to the crowd control reduction of Blinding Flash.

Damage Reduction for each set:
  • SWK is 50%, 50%, 40%.
  • LoN is 52%, 50%, 50%, but the last 50% relies on an 8% proc.

However, it's fairly clear that the DPS of Lashing Tailkick is nearly 3 times higher using the set. This is due to the 3000% set buff and the Bastions Will buff that you're able to get instead of the LoN 1300% buff. Sometimes killing enemies faster means that you don't have to sustain as much damage.

You could argue that the Laws of Seph combined with Blinding flash and not casting Sweeping winds would equal more LTK casting. If it can cast LTK 6 times in the same time it takes SWK to cast LTK twice, it would be similar in DPS.


These are my findings, do with them as you please :)
 
Last edited:
Ahh right, I see what you mean now. I just thought LON was better since i saw some streamers, youtube guides etc for it. Maybe it's more comfortable to play?
 
qvazmir said:
Ahh right, I see what you mean now. I just thought LON was better since i saw some streamers, youtube guides etc for it. Maybe it's more comfortable to play?
Click to expand...

I think that it might be less struggle with spirit, making LTK more spammable. This might lead to more fireballs being cast, making up some of the dps.

I have all of the items on my Monk itemlists just so that I can test it out but my hopes arent as high as when I first looked at it.
 
TwoCigars said:
I think that it might be less struggle with spirit, making LTK more spammable. This might lead to more fireballs being cast, making up some of the dps.

I have all of the items on my Monk itemlists just so that I can test it out but my hopes arent as high as when I first looked at it.
Click to expand...


Can you test GR 70 speedfarms? If it can do them in 3-4 minutes deathless, it may be worth making one. It is after all faster than crus on T13 farming with ingeom.
 
Rank 1 monk EU is using LON ltk atm, cleared 89, gonna make one now.
 
I am using .670.

There currently isnt a specific build for the LoN setup. You can choose in the routine menu to force override the routine to LTK.

It likely will not handle Blinding flash "optimally" since it's not programmed directly into the LTK routine.. However, it is included in the combatbase for monk so it should still be cast in theory:
Code: 
        protected virtual bool ShouldBlindingFlash()
        {
            if (!Skills.Monk.BlindingFlash.CanCast())
                return false;


            if (HasInstantCooldowns && !Skills.Monk.Epiphany.IsLastUsed)
                return true;


            var lowHealth = Player.CurrentHealthPct <= 0.4;
            var enoughStuffToBlind = TargetUtil.AnyElitesInRange(15, 1) || TargetUtil.AnyMobsInRange(15, 3);
            var blindCurrentTarget = CurrentTarget != null && CurrentTarget.IsElite && CurrentTarget.RadiusDistance <= 15f;


            return lowHealth || enoughStuffToBlind || blindCurrentTarget;
        }
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top