one optimized and customizable cc package? or multiple custom cc?

[haukinyau]

just a quick question, probably directed to all cc maker...

wouldn't it best to gather all men power to build a optimized and customizable cc package than each cc dev release their own version ending up confusing the user which one best suit them?

the concept probably same as any open source project, having all people contributing to the project for one objective.

Pro : more time invested on a single work to achieve its purpose
(think as, if 1 dev spent 1hour a day on one work, 3 dev would make it 3hours spent to that particular work, making the progress much faster)

Con : probably trouble synchronize work among dev due to diffent timezone and etc...

Plus : now that it only has one universal and official CC used, user no longer confused about which CC to use , also be happy about the efficiency and quality of the work.
In addition, each dev no longer spent time fixing bugs/weaknesses only to know that there is another cc working as good as his cc

*on topic*
Please keep this as a discussion. Never my intention to put any pressure or offense anyone. All in my mind how to improve this great product. I have no programming skills so i doing my part providing feedback as a customer.

Kindly post your reply with the following format for ease of reading to other member

Pro :

Con :

Comment :

 

[fpsware]

No.

The way I write CCs, the combat rotation I want to add is different from that of others.

This way, people have choice. If something is not to their liking they have options.

 

[haukinyau]

No.

The way I write CCs, the combat rotation I want to add is different from that of others.

This way, people have choice. If something is not to their liking they have options.

I understand your point of stand, but a rotation is how one skill is cast followed by another skill, correct me if i'm wrong. In that case, probably something like Singularity probably be the base design for the universal CC package.

The way I write CCs, the combat rotation I want to add is different from that of others.

yes, indeed, the coding style or the way how one person wanted the bot to act differs. In this case, perhaps a discussion among dev to find the best approach for the bot will be sufficient.

the whole purpose of this suggestion is so that features from many CC could be included into one work. Plus, any existing CC wont go hiatus due to Dev issue if the workload is shared. Example, Singularity went "On-Hold" for Dev personal issue.

HB initially sold as bot and only comes with default cc with no customization, to now have plentiful custom CC to choose from by the courtesy forum member. May be the idea to for a centralized CC with opensource concept can be taken into consideration so that any feature from different CC wont be "wasted" if anytime the original CC author decided not to provide support anymore.

Maybe there is technical limitation beyond my understand preventing an universal and free-to-customize-the-rotation CC to be implemented, or simply just the Owner(Bossland) policy on this matter, or perhaps management issue its too much hassle for this, the idea alone should appreciated.

Thank you all for even spent time reading this and thank you too for voting. Do write a reply if any member have anywords on this matter that they wish for a change in HB how the CC is managed.

 

[mistatic]

The problem that I would believe would arise is that say there is one CC that is great for combat while another is great for healing there may be a problem with which one to choose.

Also I do not feel it is that difficult to search through the forums for the one that is the best for your needs and spec.

 

[CodenameG]

thats why we have people working on CC's like the one linked below, you can customize to your hearts content and it works for all classes. as for making 4+ CC developers to work together, to make something to cover all classes, the way you want done, just isnt going to happen. you have better luck making a cat and dog live together. with out bringing upon the wrath of Gozer. and accidentally summoning a stay puff marsh mellow man that destroys new york. Well ill tell you this! I aint Fraid of no ghost!

http://www.thebuddyforum.com/showthread.php?10954-Singularity-The-Dynamic-Behaviour-Custom-Class

 

[Pios]

lol, good quote

 

[haukinyau]

The problem that I would believe would arise is that say there is one CC that is great for combat while another is great for healing there may be a problem with which one to choose.

Also I do not feel it is that difficult to search through the forums for the one that is the best for your needs and spec.

While its simple to keep everything separated and certain CC only optimized for certain purposes, it also meant the support for the work is minimal only by the effort and generosity of its author, we the user have no assurance on any CC support to begin with and is this the proper way it is for HB after 1year. No consideration on perhaps, managing the CC more effectively in terms of development and project way path...

Will CC still be treated merely as an additional feature, where the availability and the quality of the CC is not covered in HB?

thats why we have people working on CC's like the one linked below, you can customize to your hearts content and it works for all classes. as for making 4+ CC developers to work together, to make something to cover all classes, the way you want done, just isnt going to happen. you have better luck making a cat and dog live together. with out bringing upon the wrath of Gozer. and accidentally summoning a stay puff marsh mellow man that destroys new york. Well ill tell you this! I aint Fraid of no ghost!

http://www.thebuddyforum.com/showthread.php?10954-Singularity-The-Dynamic-Behaviour-Custom-Class

there is dog and cat living together, well, if CodenameG, one of the major CC dev felt such way, picture things to this extend, figure what will happen to HB if somehow, any CC dev decided to stop wow and botting at all.

Will the existing CC that worked so well, abandoned just like that, and we user just hope another generous member step up and share his work with the community again.

Example, Wikipedia started as a free-time project with no financial support. Over the time, it gained popularity and people benefits from its existence, the Wikipedia finally now maintained by a group of people and financially self-sufficient.

What I'm saying is, will HB consider making CC development another of it's official core project, rather than depending on the forum member...

How I wish to see in HB someday, when i start the bot, and click "CC Configuration" and see FPS's CC, CodeNameG' CC , mordd's CC etc etc, all the goodies in one , knowing it is HB official CC,supported and development is guaranteed-in-a-way .... CC no longer called by names, instead, it'll be [official]CC 1.2 , CC 2.2 etc etc, credits to etc etc dev. (naming is not the issue, but since its all in one, credits need to be given accordingly)

Then new idea or suggestion for the so-called "[Official]CC" can be added if one just say
"i have idea, why not put a new feature blablabla , suggestion code as etcetcxyz123" , then working together to include it~

 

[exfelon]

thats why we have people working on CC's like the one linked below, you can customize to your hearts content and it works for all classes. as for making 4+ CC developers to work together, to make something to cover all classes, the way you want done, just isnt going to happen. you have better luck making a cat and dog live together. with out bringing upon the wrath of Gozer. and accidentally summoning a stay puff marsh mellow man that destroys new york. Well ill tell you this! I aint Fraid of no ghost!

http://www.thebuddyforum.com/showthread.php?10954-Singularity-The-Dynamic-Behaviour-Custom-Class

I wouldn't touch that post with a 10 meter cattle prod. In other words, BACK OF MAN I'M A SCIENTIST!

 

[CodenameG]

While its simple to keep everything separated and certain CC only optimized for certain purposes, it also meant the support for the work is minimal only by the effort and generosity of its author, we the user have no assurance on any CC support to begin with and is this the proper way it is for HB after 1year. No consideration on perhaps, managing the CC more effectively in terms of development and project way path...

Will CC still be treated merely as an additional feature, where the availability and the quality of the CC is not covered in HB?



there is dog and cat living together, well, if CodenameG, one of the major CC dev felt such way, picture things to this extend, figure what will happen to HB if somehow, any CC dev decided to stop wow and botting at all.

Will the existing CC that worked so well, abandoned just like that, and we user just hope another generous member step up and share his work with the community again.

Example, Wikipedia started as a free-time project with no financial support. Over the time, it gained popularity and people benefits from its existence, the Wikipedia finally now maintained by a group of people and financially self-sufficient.

What I'm saying is, will HB consider making CC development another of it's official core project, rather than depending on the forum member...

How I wish to see in HB someday, when i start the bot, and click "CC Configuration" and see FPS's CC, CodeNameG' CC , mordd's CC etc etc, all the goodies in one , knowing it is HB official CC,supported and development is guaranteed-in-a-way .... CC no longer called by names, instead, it'll be [official]CC 1.2 , CC 2.2 etc etc, credits to etc etc dev. (naming is not the issue, but since its all in one, credits need to be given accordingly)

Then new idea or suggestion for the so-called "[Official]CC" can be added if one just say
"i have idea, why not put a new feature blablabla , suggestion code as etcetcxyz123" , then working together to include it~

heres the thing i wouldn't team up with fpsware and mordd, to make something, no matter how big. but abandoned projects are different from currently developed ones. with permission, anyone should be able to pick up and continue that work. take Bobby's ShamWoW for instance, the only shaman CC, and he decided to quit. there was someone there to pick up that slack, we had i think it was as many as 4 diffrent people providing updates over the time he was gone, till he came back. someone will always step up to the plate or make something better to replace it. as far as HB Sponsored CC's like you would like to see, it isnt going to happen. because 1 im happy with the donations i get, i haven't gotten 1 in 3 months, but still. as soon as bossland starts tossing money at rookie or even experienced CC / Plugin devs, one of two things will happen.
1. People will see that they can make money from deving anything and there will be a influx of bad projects that will be unused and unloved and really just have an over-abundance of code thats duplicated effort, and not done very well.

2. People will see that they have a certain Set of paid CC developers and wont try making new ones or making new code. the new ideas and innovation and competition will stop. and CC's will get stale.

and we already have a set of "Offical" CC's the Default Set that comes with honorbuddy. and this time around, more of us got a chance to toss better code. for example i wrote the Default Mage CC, and Fpsware is writing the Default Warrior. no matter what happens to me, or fpsware, if i where to die tomorrow (it could happen) then someone would update that CC because its part of the product, they just CANT not have a default mage CC, someone has to do it. so honestly i dont see what the problem is. my only guess is, you want something all in one file, so its hard to replace individual classes. and even harder for new people coming in to learn from. its kinda like saying, ok everyone gets a Ferrari in place of any car they currently have, so everyone is driving that car. for one, the auto industry would die. so no more competition. i guess what im saying is, try applying your idea, to something else, because it wouldn't work.

look bottom line, in case you dont actually read my wall of text. when you buy honorbuddy you get a set of CC's 1 per class. nothing else has to be guaranteed. if a developer quits and X CC that you love isnt working any more, then too bad. there's nothing that can be done. because its not an official CC that you bought with the product.

 

[Pios]

My personal thoughts on this subject.

Now, I know when I started doing CC development that this is done not out of the need for money, nor recognition, nor anything else. However it would appear that lately there has been a trend that even though the custom classes created by developers in there free time, gives the average user on the forums the right, yes the RIGHT to demand support for it, while it is nice to have support for any given custom class that is not by default included in the Honorbuddy suite, it is by no means an right at all.

I know, i had some personal issues when i put my project on hold for a day or 2, and while this has zero relevance on the maintenance and functions of the HB core application, a very nice person came to my aid, and i am now able to continue my development, believe me, when i say, that I personally, didn't have any feeling of entitlement to get this help at all, and this help was given freely by the person.

Now back on topic, Yes, there are members of this community that feel they are owed some kind of support by people doing a lot of very hard work. This in my humble opinion is as wrong as it gets, to quote myself on IRC
"You, my friend, are entitle to jack!", we do this cause we can,not because you asked for it, nor because we owe you anything.

As far as expecting the owners of honorbuddy to pick up the bill for all the custom classes, I personally do no feel the should ever need to pick up the bill for our custom classes.
In regards to all the CC authors working on the same project, I don't think this is a good, diversity is a good thing, imagine the OP's own musings, the project gets so bogged down in the political jousting(and believe me that will happen), that nothing ever gets released? would this be alright ?

Now, the OP did say that its a good thing, but in the end it will be like trying to herd cats while walking blindfolded, in fact that may be easyer.

 

[neodite]

Works both ways tho im afraid. YOU don't have to make things, you have to expect people reporting problems and wanting fixes.

If you don't like it and get upset that easy, then don't bother, as you said you dont have too

 

[Kickazz006]

The default ones that are included are for a base model. People make their own CC's b/c thats how they play or want the rotation to be. I find a "master" CC kind of optionless. Its like saying everyone has to use the GB profile to farm with...

 

[mezz0]

I like 'stuffs', it sounds important.

 

[Kamilche]

Making a single class work for all classes, would mean they would all work poorly. Though there are many similarities between the classes - they all need to eat/drink/heal, for instance, there, the similarity ends.

I'm a professional programmer, and had kicked around the idea of making such a beast. I put all the 'similar' code in a base class, and just concentrated on the differences. I had contemplated making a decision table to handle all interesting bits, such as 'current health', 'number of attackers', interesting cooldowns, and the like. When I totted it up, it would have been a monster decision table with over 400,000 entries, just for a simple response from a single class!

Code has its place, and in HonorBuddy's case, custom code for each class, is best.

 

[haukinyau]

this thread is considered dead, as current CC devs do not support the idea of "few people making one thing works"...

they rather have few people doing similar things, than working together (they do talk to each other for ideas, but still considered an individual work)

further discussions is not needed. The CC devs is not paid for their work and anyone should respect their decisions. Lets just hope HB/GB sell enough to hire people working on CC.

 

[goodmorning]

this thread is considered dead, as current CC devs do not support the idea of "few people making one thing works"...

they rather have few people doing similar things, than working together (they do talk to each other for ideas, but still considered an individual work)

further discussions is not needed. The CC devs is not paid for their work and anyone should respect their decisions. Lets just hope HB/GB sell enough to hire people working on CC.

Hell, we should just pay Bobby to do all the CCs. ShamWOW is the best of the bunch, hands down.

 

[Mannyste]

every CC posted on this forum with good code and in working condition tested by the bot maker's and general public testers should be implememted into the standard Honorbuddy default programme. When the novice player buys honorbuddy he downloads the client Logs into wow selects his character and spec and he is given a LIST of cc's to use.

Thats how it should happen and thats how the pvp, instancebuddy, grindbot and questing bot should work aswell All working XML files should be implemented into the standard honorbuddy defaul downloadable rdy for the novice user to pick.

If the novice user decides to open up his web browser and navigate his/her way to the honorbuddy forums to ask a question or search about a Feature that is relevent to his playstyle and get's no feedback the only way forward is for that user to learn the CODE and make the feature himself.

Then we go around full circle and the bot maker's and general public can test this feature the novice user made make sure it's in working condition. Make a decision on wether it is viable to implement into the defaul honorbuddy downloadable.

 

[fpsware]

hell, we should just pay bobby to do all the ccs. Shamwow is the best of the bunch, hands down.

;o














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[ski]

Hell, we should just pay Bobby to do all the CCs. ShamWOW is the best of the bunch, hands down.

For a minute there I thought you said fpsware

 

[ski]

;o














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Woooooooooops