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February 2014 update on legal

B

bossland

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2010
Messages
14,883
The new year started,

and we already have booked dates to different courts:

* yesterday we where in Hamburg, as we got an interim injunction to not sell Diablo 3 Gold, .. more about it below ...
* on 27th May we are in Leipzig, the court hearing is about, if i am personally liable for the actions of the company, if there are any actions of the company that are agains the law
* on 1st July we are in Munich, the court hearing is about, if any contract exists between blizzard and us

that are all regional courts.

On the already done rulings about Honorbuddy and Demonbuddy, we are still waiting for the regional appeal court of Hamburg to give us a date for the hearings, last year we where informed that this should be around Q1 2014.

Yesterday,

we finally got to the point where the court has to decide, if there is a contract between Blizzard and its customers, or not.
The oppinion of the court was, that at the point of the purchase, no contracts except the purchase contract where concluded. They are not sure yet, how to decide about the contract that Blizzard wants to put between them and the end-user when creating the battle.net account. However the european court decided 2012 in a scimilar case UsedSoft vs Oracle (Intellectual Property Issues: usedSoft GmbH v. Oracle: Are You Exhausted Yet?). And when looking into Blizzard, it seems that either they sell a pointless DVD for 30 EUR and then you close a contract with them, to actually be able to play the game you just bought and wasted your money on, or you do buy a full game in the store with all the rights included, to play it and sell it and so on.

Anyway, we will see how the court will decide, the ruling should be there until midmonth March.
 
So far no botting company has won any court case to blizzard

Any that have gone to court have ended up broke because of legal fees and have lost the cases as well this is the end result of any case in botting as blizzard feels it damages the game in many ways it is true

In the time blizzard has released World of Warcraft there has been a bot of some kind killing it and gathering items this is where they have not had any time to fix the gathering problem in the game

It is really sad that if Bossland loses he will lose every thing he owns as he can not turn back as he has gone to a very high court this is a result he can not declare bankrupt now in the end blizzard had won more than they could think of it

I am sure they would of given him a chance to stop but I am sure he has his reason why not to as he is making a large amount of money off a legit company to make his earning legit a lot have done this and have lost big time which is so true
 
Hat?r said:
So far no botting company has won any court case to blizzard

Any that have gone to court have ended up broke because of legal fees and have lost the cases as well this is the end result of any case in botting as blizzard feels it damages the game in many ways it is true

In the time blizzard has released World of Warcraft there has been a bot of some kind killing it and gathering items this is where they have not had any time to fix the gathering problem in the game

It is really sad that if Bossland loses he will lose every thing he owns as he can not turn back as he has gone to a very high court this is a result he can not declare bankrupt now in the end blizzard had won more than they could think of it

I am sure they would of given him a chance to stop but I am sure he has his reason why not to as he is making a large amount of money off a legit company to make his earning legit a lot have done this and have lost big time which is so true
Click to expand...

But all botting companys who lose with blizz have office in USA if I good remember. EU law is different.

Hmm, sorry, wrong info, Pirox was in Germany...
 
mugenji77 said:
But all botting companys who lose with blizz have office in USA if I good remember. EU law is different.

Hmm, sorry, wrong info, Pirox was in Germany...
Click to expand...
Pirox did probably not have a clue about german or international laws and took the bot down as soon as blizzard threatened to take him to court. While I do not have any knowledge I suspect he accepted a proposal of getting a sum of money and in return took the program down.
 
99dsimonp said:
Pirox did probably not have a clue about german or international laws and took the bot down as soon as blizzard threatened to take him to court. While I do not have any knowledge I suspect he accepted a proposal of getting a sum of money and in return took the program down.
Click to expand...

"It is often better to remain silent and thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt."

Pirox was fully conversant in the laws that were applicable to him. Pirox did not take the bot down as soon as he was threatened nor did he lose any court battles. You make him sound like an idiot or a coward. Both of which are far from the truth.

He was offered a sum of money in exchange for his code and all rights to that code. After some negotiation he chose to accept that offer. He is a businessman. He created a product, proved it's worth and then sold it at a profit. There is nothing wrong with that.
 
it would help if you actually stated what these upcoming hearing might mean practically. for example, the hearing in march about contract, if that goes wrong does that have a chance to stop HB immediately? eg, you can't sell it and can't keep the login servers up.

as for pirox, he didn't lose any case, as none existed. they just told him that they'll be starting legal proceedings just like vs glider and bossland, and he didnt feel like dealing with that.
 
JimT said:
He was offered a sum of money in exchange for his code and all rights to that code. After some negotiation he chose to accept that offer. He is a businessman. He created a product, proved it's worth and then sold it at a profit. There is nothing wrong with that.
Click to expand...

Thats wrong sorry. No code was sold or given to blizz nor any user data was. I know the details but as pirox was my former employer I am not allowed to talk about this.
Proof is that after closing down Pirox there was no big ban wave of pirox bot users afterwards. Blizz would have done this if they got the code.
Bossland is doing a great job here and is taking a high risk. Not because I work here, but also privately I keep my fingers crossed for him every day.
 
JimT said:
"It is often better to remain silent and thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt."

Pirox was fully conversant in the laws that were applicable to him. Pirox did not take the bot down as soon as he was threatened nor did he lose any court battles. You make him sound like an idiot or a coward. Both of which are far from the truth.

He was offered a sum of money in exchange for his code and all rights to that code. After some negotiation he chose to accept that offer. He is a businessman. He created a product, proved it's worth and then sold it at a profit. There is nothing wrong with that.
Click to expand...

Thank you for the excellent quote, you must be great at making friends! :)
My entire post was speculation from my side - I do not have any knowledge of the case as I tried to make clear. My experience was that the site and bot was closed one day to another with a rather cryptic message, saying Pirox had decided to stop because of Blizzard (that is, if my memory serves me well, give me another quote and a correction if it doesn't). :)

My apologies for making it sound like I accused him of being an idiot or a coward.
 
BotOperator said:
Thats wrong sorry. No code was sold or given to blizz nor any user data was. I know the details but as pirox was my former employer I am not allowed to talk about this.
Proof is that after closing down Pirox there was no big ban wave of pirox bot users afterwards. Blizz would have done this if they got the code.
Bossland is doing a great job here and is taking a high risk. Not because I work here, but also privately I keep my fingers crossed for him every day.
Click to expand...

This. Pirox did not go to court, he got an offer, without giving up code or users, and took it. Fair play i say. Boss, as far as i can tell, hasn't taken a pay-off though i am sure it has been offered. No facts to back this up ofc, just conjecture judging on ways Blizz has acted in the past. Meaning he actually believes Blizz is in the wrong and feels he can win. Also the fact Blizz had to pay a hefty sum to German courts to stop sales of the bot with certain functions enabled while the court case is going on speaks volumes of their own concerns.

*shrug* I just like he is standing up for the fact he believes Blizz is wrong. Simple as that. Or it seems that way :)
 
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