Confused about new nav system

[dayloon]

Hi folks,

While im very impressed with HB2, im a little confused about the nav system. From what i understood, the bot basically had all the map/terrain info and knew exactly where it can go, where it can't go and would run around almost like a normal player. But in the PVP test i did today, it basically just ran a loop of exactly the same waypoints over and over again. A bit like glider before ppather came along. I was under the impression that it was now capable of going anywhere and not just sticking to set waypoints.

Sorry if i've not explained this very well, hopefully you know what i mean.

Cheers

 

[bigboyinlove]

Great question! Looking forward for a response to clarify. I'm curious myself.

 

[Haygu]

The new system search for the perfect way to go...
The Problem: It use everytime the perfect way, but the perfect way never changes

 

[MaiN]

It is capable of going anywhere. Give it any two valid start/end points and you will get a path.
What you see is to be expected because the logic Detour uses, always (some exceptions I won't bother explaining) finds the path with the highest score or lowest cost. That means if you generate from the same start point to the same end point you will always get the same path.

 

[rcadams]

maybe want we need to see is a random path option added... So we don't look like a bot running the same path.. This would also stop other HB people in BG's from always using the same path too.

It is capable of going anywhere. Give it any two valid start/end points and you will get a path.
What you see is to be expected because the logic Detour uses, always (some exceptions I won't bother explaining) finds the path with the highest score or lowest cost. That means if you generate from the same start point to the same end point you will always get the same path.

 

[MaiN]

maybe want we need to see is a random path option added... So we don't look like a bot running the same path.. This would also stop other HB people in BG's from always using the same path too.

It's possible and easy to add but it goes against the logic I like. That logic is to always have it spit out the optimal path.
There is another way to fix this issue, which I believe is better. I've said this twice before. Instead of fixing it at the navigation level, I think it should be fixed at the profile level.
Instead of defining multiple single point hotspots in the profile, you define multiple area definitions. This way we could randomly pick a point in one of these areas and path to it.

 

[bigboyinlove]

It's possible and easy to add but it goes against the logic I like. That logic is to always have it spit out the optimal path.
There is another way to fix this issue, which I believe is better. I've said this twice before. Instead of fixing it at the navigation level, I think it should be fixed at the profile level.
Instead of defining multiple single point hotspots in the profile, you define multiple area definitions. This way we could randomly pick a point in one of these areas and path to it.

I was about to suggest such after your first explanation. I think this is probably the best way to go and having a random seed that you can define so that your pathing can be unique. Even being able to randomize that random seed would really offer a great way of randomizing path generations -- especially in BG's like WG.

 

[moritzmdm]

i think the new nav-system is shit, because my char stuck at all the Lanterns...

 

[Zeerow]

i think the new nav-system is shit, because my char stuck at all the Lanterns...

Hmm, it might be better to judge it once it's out of beta, no?

 

[rcadams]

And that would be even better if it could detect how many oppisite fraction toons are in the area and base the decision to go there with biggest possible kill ratio. Nothing worse then running to an area that is empty. Specially in Bg's like AV.. You get everyone msg you, or even reporting you.

It's possible and easy to add but it goes against the logic I like. That logic is to always have it spit out the optimal path.
There is another way to fix this issue, which I believe is better. I've said this twice before. Instead of fixing it at the navigation level, I think it should be fixed at the profile level.
Instead of defining multiple single point hotspots in the profile, you define multiple area definitions. This way we could randomly pick a point in one of these areas and path to it.

 

[rcadams]

OMG this isn't an issue, you know how many times I get stuck running into stuff.. As long as the bot fixes it self when it notices it's stuck this will never be a real issue.. If you are stuck there for 3mins or more yes. Then it's a HB issue more then the nav system.

i think the new nav-system is shit, because my char stuck at all the Lanterns...

 

[dayloon]

i think the new nav-system is shit, because my char stuck at all the Lanterns...

lol, say what you think. Don't hold back

 

[zomgmage]

It's possible and easy to add but it goes against the logic I like. That logic is to always have it spit out the optimal path.
There is another way to fix this issue, which I believe is better. I've said this twice before. Instead of fixing it at the navigation level, I think it should be fixed at the profile level.
Instead of defining multiple single point hotspots in the profile, you define multiple area definitions. This way we could randomly pick a point in one of these areas and path to it.

While my HB profile making is limited... How would one go about defining a while area instead of a few hot spots?

 

[Hawker]

While my HB profile making is limited... How would one go about defining a while area instead of a few hot spots?

You can simply edit your wsg profile to add different hotspots. They will then be yours and no-one will ever run your path.

 

[MaiN]

While my HB profile making is limited... How would one go about defining a while area instead of a few hot spots?

Could write a real editor for that.

 

[dayloon]

Could write a real editor for that.

Sounds like you're offering

 

[bigboyinlove]

Hey Hawker,

Is it possible for HB2 to be able to script dynamic profiles? Would be nice to be able to set a function or array of a set of hotspots which can ran using a random number. Then even be able to nest another random number within that function to randomize another set of hotspots within the function. There would be many applications to this.

for example going between offensive and defensive in WG:
(not actual code, just roughing out the idea)

randTime = 300; //seconds -- threshold to randomly choose the function
subRandTime = 60; //seconds -- threshold to randomly choose hotspots


getOffensive(subRandTime) {
    /// Multi-dimensional array or dictionary
    hotspots = { 
        1: array {'spot1', 'spot2', 'spot3', 'spot4'};
        2: array {'spot1', 'spot2', 'spot3', 'spot4'};
        3: array {'spot1', 'spot2', 'spot3', 'spot4'};
    }
    
    //// Pick Random sets of hotspots every subRandTime    
    subInitialTime = getCurrTime().epoch;
    subRandomNumber = rand() % (siezof(hotspots) - 1);
    while ( (getCurrTime().epoch - subInitialTime) < subRandTime) {
        // Dont know how the hotspots are called, but this is where the hotspot loop is fired.
        for (i=0; i < sizeof(hotspots[subRandomNumber]); i++){
            // loop through hotspots
            gotoHotSpot(hotspots[subRandomNumber][i]);
        }
    }
    
    return;
}

getDefensive(subRandTime) {
    //// this would have a similar definition as above
    //// but with different hotspots defined
}

/// Pick Random profileFunction every randTime
initialTime = getCurrTime().epoch;
randomNumber = rand() % 1;
while ( (getCurrTime().epoch - initialTime) < randTime ) {
    if (randomNumber == 0) { getOffensive(subRandTime) }
    if (randomNumber == 1) { getDefensive(subRandTime) }
}

Hope this made sense.

 

[ski]

Hey Hawker,

Is it possible for HB2 to be able to script dynamic profiles? Would be nice to be able to set a function or array of a set of hotspots which can ran using a random number. Then even be able to nest another random number within that function to randomize another set of hotspots within the function. There would be many applications to this.

for example going between offensive and defensive in WG:
(not actual code, just roughing out the idea)

randTime = 300; //seconds -- threshold to randomly choose the function
subRandTime = 60; //seconds -- threshold to randomly choose hotspots


getOffensive(subRandTime) {
    /// Multi-dimensional array or dictionary
    hotspots = { 
        1: array {'spot1', 'spot2', 'spot3', 'spot4'};
        2: array {'spot1', 'spot2', 'spot3', 'spot4'};
        3: array {'spot1', 'spot2', 'spot3', 'spot4'};
    }
    
    //// Pick Random sets of hotspots every subRandTime    
    subInitialTime = getCurrTime().epoch;
    subRandomNumber = rand() % (siezof(hotspots) - 1);
    while ( (getCurrTime().epoch - subInitialTime) < subRandTime) {
        // Dont know how the hotspots are called, but this is where the hotspot loop is fired.
        for (i=0; i < sizeof(hotspots[subRandomNumber]); i++){
            // loop through hotspots
            gotoHotSpot(hotspots[subRandomNumber][i]);
        }
    }
    
    return;
}

getDefensive(subRandTime) {
    //// this would have a similar definition as above
    //// but with different hotspots defined
}

/// Pick Random profileFunction every randTime
initialTime = getCurrTime().epoch;
randomNumber = rand() % 1;
while ( (getCurrTime().epoch - initialTime) < randTime ) {
    if (randomNumber == 0) { getOffensive(subRandTime) }
    if (randomNumber == 1) { getDefensive(subRandTime) }
}

Hope this made sense.

You should be able to do this in a plugin, since you can load/unload profiles via a plugin. Please make it

 

[moritzmdm]

OMG this isn't an issue, you know how many times I get stuck running into stuff.. As long as the bot fixes it self when it notices it's stuck this will never be a real issue.. If you are stuck there for 3mins or more yes. Then it's a HB issue more then the nav system.

yes, my char stuck for 3mins and more

 

[Nomfather]

This thread reminds me, Eprofilecreator isnt updated for hb2, best download the old one again to make some profiles.