MP0 vs. MP1 in act3

[mginster]

what plugins did u used to get these stats?

Trinity and RadsAtom running ciggarc A3.

A more current view of my MP0 farming is...

Total tracking time: 4h 13m 41s
Total deaths: 5 [1.18 per hour]
Total items dropped: 2966 [701.5 per hour]
- ilvl63: 432 [102.17 per hour] {14.57 %}
--- ilvl 63 Rare: 76 [17.98 per hour] {2.56 %}

 

[Splitty]

MP0 is the best for botting. Even if you have to gear to clear higher MP levels with 0 deaths, MP0 is still superior in every aspect.

How do you know this, can you prove it in some way? As much as I want to believe it, it seems unlikely.

 

[Coupons]

How do you know this, can you prove it in some way? As much as I want to believe it, it seems unlikely.

Maybe you could try the different monster powers yourself and compare GPH, EXP/H and items/H? I mean, those stats are there for a reason. I tried several different monster powers and can confirm 0 is top farmability. If you want to bot MP5 and never pay attention to dp/h, gp/h, exp/h, items/h then sure, there's absolutely no way to prove it in any way. Also I don't think other people are going to do that work for you. Can YOU prove that a higher monster power is more profitable?

 

[placebro]

Only reason to bot higher MP's is if you want keys too, otherwise MP 0 for act 3 and MP 1 for act 1, 2 are best.

 

[Oggy2k5]

I've botted MP1, 2 and 3, for quite a few good hours. From looking at results, I've hardly gained anything worth selling from MP3, and due to it being far slower to farm then MP1. I think I would rather farm MP1.

 

[stormwarr1]

Not if you have such high dps that you kill the monsters in higher Monster Power the same speed as MP0

That can't happen unless you one shot each champ. Also keep in mind, you can drop a lot of survivability stats at MP0 cause you don't need all that much. Cheaper gear, more dps etc etc.

 

[placebro]

Not if you have such high dps that you kill the monsters in higher Monster Power the same speed as MP0

Every time someone says this I want to take a sledgehammer and bash my fucking foot. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand that this is technically impossible.

Please read this post if you haven't already - and if you have, please read it again until you understand.

That can't happen unless you one shot each champ. Also keep in mind, you can drop a lot of survivability stats at MP0 cause you don't need all that much. Cheaper gear, more dps etc etc.

MP 0, with enough gear you can afford to drop all defensive stats and focus completely on high damage and max movement speed. The higher MP you go, the more defensive stats become important. And as soon as you start sacrificing some damage for some defense, your runs become slower. As soon as you die even once or twice in a run, your bot has to make it all the way back to where it was, making the run that much longer.

Sure, if you have billions of gold in gear, still have 2 Skorns equipped, then you might be able to 1 shot every single mob in higher MP's while still maintaining max movement speed and not having any deaths. But you don't have billions of gold in gear, so no matter what, MP 0 is the most optimal choice.

 

[Decard_Cain]

Every time someone says this I want to take a sledgehammer and bash my fucking foot. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand that this is technically impossible.

Please read this post if you haven't already - and if you have, please read it again until you understand.


MP 0, with enough gear you can afford to drop all defensive stats and focus completely on high damage and max movement speed. The higher MP you go, the more defensive stats become important. And as soon as you start sacrificing some damage for some defense, your runs become slower. As soon as you die even once or twice in a run, your bot has to make it all the way back to where it was, making the run that much longer.

Sure, if you have billions of gold in gear, still have 2 Skorns equipped, then you might be able to 1 shot every single mob in higher MP's while still maintaining max movement speed and not having any deaths. But you don't have billions of gold in gear, so no matter what, MP 0 is the most optimal choice.

Although I agree it is impossible to one shot mobs at higher MP levels anyone who says it's not worth it to go higher is also wrong. You dont need to kill things as fast as u do in mp 0 in higher levels, you just need to kill fast enough that the bonus item drop stats/magic find increases your IPH higher than than previous MP levels, which IS possible. I now run on mp4 with a 2h WW build with shout/grim harvest added for the extra 15% item drop. on MP0 i average 690-720 IPH with 0DPH over an 8 hour period for three sessions. When I got a few extra pieces of gear I went up MP levels untill my IPH started dropping. I am currently on MP4 with an average 835IPH and .65DPH over an 8 hour session.

Quick list to make it easy:

-Run speed (thats the actual run not movement. movement speed is necessary) is important but it is always trumped by Items Per Hour.
-Running test sessions of 30 min - 1 hour is not enough data to support IPH claims. You need time for DPH, Lag, Restarts, Stucks, and other situations to enter in to the calculations.
-Run these extended tests on each MP until your IPH starts to go down, but also take into account how many of those items are Rare/Legendary.
-It is extremely possible to get better results at higher MP levels, it is simply based on gear.
-If your IPH is higher at higher MP levels, then keep in mind all that bonus MF will come into effect.
-DPH is negligent if your IPH is still higher than previous levels. If your dying every 2 seconds obv u wont see an increase but in the 4-8dph range its possible.


my unbuffed dps with a Skorn is 130k. My IPH starts to falter around mp5-6 so I am sticking to MP4 for the time being.

 

[Coupons]

Although I agree it is impossible to one shot mobs at higher MP levels anyone who says it's not worth it to go higher is also wrong. You dont need to kill things as fast as u do in mp 0 in higher levels, you just need to kill fast enough that the bonus item drop stats/magic find increases your IPH higher than than previous MP levels, which IS possible. I now run on mp4 with a 2h WW build with shout/grim harvest added for the extra 15% item drop. on MP0 i average 690-720 IPH with 0DPH over an 8 hour period for three sessions. When I got a few extra pieces of gear I went up MP levels untill my IPH started dropping. I am currently on MP4 with an average 835IPH and .65DPH over an 8 hour session.

Quick list to make it easy:

-Run speed is important but it is always trumped by Items Per Hour.
-Running test sessions of 30 min - 1 hour is not enough data to support IPH claims. You need time for DPH, Lag, Restarts, Stucks, and other situations to enter in to the calculations.
-Run these extended tests on each MP until your IPH starts to go down, but also take into account how many of those items are Rare/Legendary.
-It is extremely possible to get better results at higher MP levels, it is simply based on gear.
-If your IPH is higher at higher MP levels, then keep in mind all that bonus MF will come into effect.


my unbuffed dps with a Skorn is 130k. My IPH starts to falter around mp5-6 so I am sticking to MP4 for the time being.

If you are at 375% mf with max paragon and NV, that means you get 4.75x drops. If you go from 375% to 400% on MP1, that is a net increase of 5.00/4.75=5%.

So you are giving enemies 50% more hp for 5% more items, doesn't sound mathematically reasonable to me.

 

[FrenchBot]

^This

 

[Decard_Cain]

im not on mp1 im on mp4... and you can throw all the numbers you want at me it doesnt change the fact that if your IPH goes up its better to run that mp level than a lower one.

 

[Decard_Cain]

and also your not taking into account the actual Item Drop % bonus on MP levels in Inferno. at mp4 im gettin an extra 26%, plus 15% from grim harvest.
Monster Power: More Guts, More Glory - Diablo III

 

[Coupons]

Fine, if you want to compare it to MP4 it's going to look even worse. "You can throw all the numbers you want at me but it doesnt change the fact" sounds like a really, really strong argument. The inferno numbers have been changed but using those:

MP4 = +357% HP, +69% damage, +45% exp, +100% MF/GF, 26% bonus item

So that is 4.57x hp, 1.69x damage

for

2.2/1.75=+26% EXP with max neph valor and no other exp items. With a +31% exp ruby, that is about 22%.
5.75/4.75=21% more items

So enemies take over 4.5x as long to kill, deal 69% more damage and you get a net of 26% exp, 21% more items, and a 26% chance per elite pack for ONE bonus item. Not to mention you will be dying more. Also if you think grim harvest is getting you legendaries and rares, you're sadly mistaken. It drops a pittance of gold, a white item or a health globe soooo yeah. OP?

 

[hetsig]

Im not sure but I think mobs in a3 mp0 is at lvl 61-63 but if you're at mp1 they are all lvl 63. Since affixes is determined on the monster lvl, mp1 would be a lot better to farm.

 

[Decard_Cain]

Fine, if you want to compare it to MP4 it's going to look even worse. "You can throw all the numbers you want at me but it doesnt change the fact" sounds like a really, really strong argument. The inferno numbers have been changed but using those:

MP4 = +357% HP, +69% damage, +45% exp, +100% MF/GF, 26% bonus item

So that is 4.57x hp, 1.69x damage

for

2.2/1.75=+26% EXP with max neph valor and no other exp items. With a +31% exp ruby, that is about 22%.
5.75/4.75=21% more items

So enemies take over 4.5x as long to kill, deal 69% more damage and you get a net of 26% exp, 21% more items, and a 26% chance per elite pack for ONE bonus item. Not to mention you will be dying more. Also if you think grim harvest is getting you legendaries and rares, you're sadly mistaken. It drops a pittance of gold, a white item or a health globe soooo yeah. OP?

Dude, argue all you want your point is VOID. How are you not grasping this. If your ITEMS PER HOUR is higher on a higher Monster Power Level you really can throw all the numbers you want in as many posts as you want, it doesn't matter. Higher IPH and higher Rares/Legendaries is MORE EFFECTIVE.

And yes grim harvest has a chance to drop items, gold, and health globes not to mention dropping incoming damage. My IPH went up 45-60 items per run with vs. without it.
Last point then I'm done talking to a brick wall, White mobs also have a chance to drop rares and legendaries, so trash becomes more valuable with that increased drop chance at higher levels as well.
One last time, the results speak for themselves, higher IPH and higher Rares/legendaries is the goal.

Edit:: Just read over your post again, your numbers are off, they lowered dmg from elites in the last hot fixes, check em out. Makes surviving alot easier and you can focus on DPS to get to that nice balance.

Monster Power Bonus Damage Reduced in Inferno - Forums - Diablo III

 

[mginster]

Although I agree it is impossible to one shot mobs at higher MP levels anyone who says it's not worth it to go higher is also wrong. You dont need to kill things as fast as u do in mp 0 in higher levels, you just need to kill fast enough that the bonus item drop stats/magic find increases your IPH higher than than previous MP levels, which IS possible. I now run on mp4 with a 2h WW build with shout/grim harvest added for the extra 15% item drop. on MP0 i average 690-720 IPH with 0DPH over an 8 hour period for three sessions. When I got a few extra pieces of gear I went up MP levels untill my IPH started dropping. I am currently on MP4 with an average 835IPH and .65DPH over an 8 hour session.

Quick list to make it easy:

-Run speed (thats the actual run not movement. movement speed is necessary) is important but it is always trumped by Items Per Hour.
-Running test sessions of 30 min - 1 hour is not enough data to support IPH claims. You need time for DPH, Lag, Restarts, Stucks, and other situations to enter in to the calculations.
-Run these extended tests on each MP until your IPH starts to go down, but also take into account how many of those items are Rare/Legendary.
-It is extremely possible to get better results at higher MP levels, it is simply based on gear.
-If your IPH is higher at higher MP levels, then keep in mind all that bonus MF will come into effect.
-DPH is negligent if your IPH is still higher than previous levels. If your dying every 2 seconds obv u wont see an increase but in the 4-8dph range its possible.


my unbuffed dps with a Skorn is 130k. My IPH starts to falter around mp5-6 so I am sticking to MP4 for the time being.

So now that you have added extra gear and went up to MP4, did you even try to do MP0 with the same gear? I guarantee your IPH will go up even more.

Do people understand how to test anything? APPLES TO APPLES.

There is absolutely no way that you will farm more IPH with 4.5x more health on mobs for 21% more items.

 

[Decard_Cain]

So now that you have added extra gear and went up to MP4, did you even try to do MP0 with the same gear? I guarantee your IPH will go up even more.

Do people understand how to test anything? APPLES TO APPLES.

Anyone with an education will agree that 4.5x longer to kill mobs for 21% more items is retarded.

I did and no it didn't, people are underestimating how many items actually drop off white mobs now in higher levels. My IPH stats which I already posted were both with the same set of gear. The whole reason i even started this experiment was because I was killing things so fast. I will be running 4 more 8 hour sessions over the next 4 days in mp0, 4,5, and 6. If this post is still going i will post the results for you.

 

[Decard_Cain]

Here are some test results, the Paragon levels differ quite alot and difference in terms of damage - oh and btw items per hour is not everything, you also have to be lucky to roll 6 properties and roll the properties good - that's what Magic Find also does! and legendaries

1: MP1 with 55k dps buff Barb WW Paragon Level is 47 less than Bot 3 --

1: MP1 with 45k dps buff Barb WW Paragon Level is 17 less than Bot 3 --


3: MP3 with 85k dps buff Barb WW


Wrath not considered a buff here btw

Some nice stats to add to the pile. I agree completely of the affixes and and number of legendarys (that part i also stated I think).
1.) have you tried mp4 at all and do you have that stat log so i can compare?
2.) I will be running the same type of tests but going from 0 to 4,5,6 because i think thats were u see the real difference with the proper stats, but have u run mp0 with your 85kdps barb? Id like to see what number you come up with compared to mp4 so i can put em next to my own when im done. If you have time to try it let me know that'd be great.

 

[borok420]

If you are one shotting trash mob in mp0 you need to raise it to mp1. it gives me better item per hr/exp/gph

 

[fasteddie78]

Im not sure but I think mobs in a3 mp0 is at lvl 61-63 but if you're at mp1 they are all lvl 63. Since affixes is determined on the monster lvl, mp1 would be a lot better to farm.

All mobs in act 3 mp 0 are lvl 63