Twerkinator
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Ye, the .75 one ^^
What is your highest sustained "true XPH"?
- Thread starter serenevisage
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- 24-26b/hr 95% alternate ancients bonus bot botting bunch call checked coming crap data forcing found gear gem gr50 grift grifts helm hours keys leoricd level measure monk option outcome people perfect red regular reliable report rift rifts run running sessions slam stocked sustained timeline true turbohud tweaking types xp/hour xph
Ye, the .75 one ^^
what code you are using for dont pikcup progress globes and ignore pain perma?
Twerkinator
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Hey Sebozz, i just made it into a guide under the guide section, and i uploaded the two trinity files there^^
TwoCigars
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Before reading this wall of text, please understand that I am trying to figure out why you want people to post this information in such a specific format with such specific rules. There are no comparisons as to how this standard of measurement will help someone improve their botting over just GRift EXP/hr alone. What exactly are we trying to prove here?
It seems like you're asking for the best sustained XP/HR using a single build, without changing builds or characters... Letting the bot run a Rift then a GRift, in that order, every time? I do not find that to be very efficient at all for a botter. Especially when you consider the bot will have a 30 second downtime after a Rift that the bot will just idle in town for. Sure you could setup the bot to leave the game every time with modifications, but are we wanting to include people who modify DB/Trinity/Adventurer to their own specs including weighting and .cs files?
When most people farm materials and rift keys together, they do suffer this 30 second downtime between Rifts as well, but at the advantage of gaining materials to get geared. You're also not considering someone picking up all materials that might drop versus someone who is picking up only legendary items. If you wanted materials included, you did not mention it in the OP.
Are we talking about trying to get your Rift+GRift time and XP/hr as high and fast as possible and turning off anything that might slow it down? This would again be an inefficient play-style for most botters.
Are we trying to figure out if it's more efficient to live through the 30 second downtime in order to farm Pools of Reflection so they are always available during GRifts? This wouldn't be relevant if someone is using a build that can occasionally die in GRifts.
If we are just trying to find a new way to explain EXP/hr using your specific set of rules that do not apply to every player, then I don't see how it's relevant to the community or different than the "e-peen" threads you described:
If we are talking about overall efficiency and trying to find the most consistent way to track it, I disagree with your statement: "The build to farm rift keys may be slightly faster but isn't really that much better (keys farmed per hour) than just using your GR build."
Clearly this varies greatly depending on class and gearing. If a Rift takes 30 seconds more without a speed build and you're getting 100 keys in a day, that's 50 minutes wasted. 50 minutes is ~5 GRifts @ >10 billion EXP/GRift. 50 billion EXP lost over a 24 hour period is 2+ billion per hour lost.
In comparison to my GRift builds (Static Gen 60+, Helltooth ~60), my Angry Chicken speed build is much faster in both sustained movement speed and the ability to kill while not stopping to attack... Even if we are just talking about sheer speed to clear a normal difficulty Rift to gain a GRift key.
...I can use this same speed build to farm 300 DB/hr on T7-T8. I point out the farming capability because it's most efficient to farm Rift keys while ALSO farming materials like Death's Breath. I do not farm GRift keys just to farm them as fast as possible, they are a byproduct of my other farming endeavors.
Call me crazy and off-topic for pointing this out, but again, I cannot conclude what is gained by measuring any metric with a specific set of rules if it leaves out other important factors of said efficiency. Sure, materials won't show up on your EXP/HR, but in the long run, efficient farming leads to getting the most EXP/hr on an account as quickly as possible.
Again I am asking, what are we trying to prove?
If you're asking for people to compare their XP/HR over a day of botting, playing however they want using whatever builds they want, I understand.
IE if you wanted to compare two playstyles over a 24 hour period and calculate the total EXP gained during that period:
...Then find the line of efficiency between GRift key farming and GRift clear time.
...Then compare this to your setup where you're farming a Rift for a GRift key, then a GRift key, and how often you have a Pool of Reflection active, on average, which should account for your deaths in GRifts.
When most people farm materials and rift keys together, they do suffer this 30 second downtime between Rifts as well, but at the advantage of gaining materials to get geared. You're also not considering someone picking up all materials that might drop versus someone who is picking up only legendary items. If you wanted materials included, you did not mention it in the OP.
Are we talking about trying to get your Rift+GRift time and XP/hr as high and fast as possible and turning off anything that might slow it down? This would again be an inefficient play-style for most botters.
Are we trying to figure out if it's more efficient to live through the 30 second downtime in order to farm Pools of Reflection so they are always available during GRifts? This wouldn't be relevant if someone is using a build that can occasionally die in GRifts.
If we are just trying to find a new way to explain EXP/hr using your specific set of rules that do not apply to every player, then I don't see how it's relevant to the community or different than the "e-peen" threads you described:
If we are talking about overall efficiency and trying to find the most consistent way to track it, I disagree with your statement: "The build to farm rift keys may be slightly faster but isn't really that much better (keys farmed per hour) than just using your GR build."
Clearly this varies greatly depending on class and gearing. If a Rift takes 30 seconds more without a speed build and you're getting 100 keys in a day, that's 50 minutes wasted. 50 minutes is ~5 GRifts @ >10 billion EXP/GRift. 50 billion EXP lost over a 24 hour period is 2+ billion per hour lost.
In comparison to my GRift builds (Static Gen 60+, Helltooth ~60), my Angry Chicken speed build is much faster in both sustained movement speed and the ability to kill while not stopping to attack... Even if we are just talking about sheer speed to clear a normal difficulty Rift to gain a GRift key.
...I can use this same speed build to farm 300 DB/hr on T7-T8. I point out the farming capability because it's most efficient to farm Rift keys while ALSO farming materials like Death's Breath. I do not farm GRift keys just to farm them as fast as possible, they are a byproduct of my other farming endeavors.
Call me crazy and off-topic for pointing this out, but again, I cannot conclude what is gained by measuring any metric with a specific set of rules if it leaves out other important factors of said efficiency. Sure, materials won't show up on your EXP/HR, but in the long run, efficient farming leads to getting the most EXP/hr on an account as quickly as possible.
Again I am asking, what are we trying to prove?
If you're asking for people to compare their XP/HR over a day of botting, playing however they want using whatever builds they want, I understand.
IE if you wanted to compare two playstyles over a 24 hour period and calculate the total EXP gained during that period:
- Have someone calculate their GRift keys farmed per hour, thus figuring out how many they need to farm to GRift for the remainder of 24 hours.
- Set the bot to key farm that many hours, then change to a GRift build and let it run the rest of the day.
- See how much EXP was gained in the 24 hours.
Example: If your speed build = 30 keys per hour, GRift build = 6 GRifts per hour
For every hour of GRift key farming, you can do 30 GRifts which take 10 minutes each.
Total time would be 360 minutes or 6 hours per set.
Total time would be 360 minutes or 6 hours per set.
Speed Farm keys for 4 hours to get 120 keys.
Spend 120 keys running 120 GRifts over 20 hours.
Summary: 2 minute Rift clears and 10 minute Grift clears = ~120 GRift clears in 24 hours.
Spend 120 keys running 120 GRifts over 20 hours.
Summary: 2 minute Rift clears and 10 minute Grift clears = ~120 GRift clears in 24 hours.
Another Example: If your speed build = 20 keys per hour, GRift build = 6 GRifts per hour
For every hour of GRift key farming, you can do 20 GRifts which take 10 minutes each.
Total time would be 260 minutes or 4.33 hours per set.
Total time would be 260 minutes or 4.33 hours per set.
Speed Farm keys for 5.5 hours to get 110 keys.
Spend 110 keys running 110 GRifts over 18.3 hours.
Summary: 3 minute Rift clears and 10 minute Grift clears = ~110 GRift clears in 24 hours.
Spend 110 keys running 110 GRifts over 18.3 hours.
Summary: 3 minute Rift clears and 10 minute Grift clears = ~110 GRift clears in 24 hours.
Last Example: If your speed build = 15 keys per hour, GRift build = 6 GRifts per hour
For every hour of GRift key farming, you can do 15 GRifts which take 10 minutes each.
Total time would be 210 minutes or 3.5 hours per set.
Total time would be 210 minutes or 3.5 hours per set.
Speed Farm keys for 7 hours to get 105 keys.
Spend 105 keys running 105 GRifts over 17.5 hours.
Summary: 4 minute Rift clears and 10 minute Grift clears = ~105 GRift clears in 24.5 hours, basically ~102 in 24 hours.
Spend 105 keys running 105 GRifts over 17.5 hours.
Summary: 4 minute Rift clears and 10 minute Grift clears = ~105 GRift clears in 24.5 hours, basically ~102 in 24 hours.
...Then find the line of efficiency between GRift key farming and GRift clear time.
Is it better to do GRift 60 at 13 minutes a GRift when you consider that you spend 2-4 minutes farming a GRift key?
Or do GRift 55 at 10 minutes per clear considering key farming time?
Or do GRift 50 at 6 Minutes per clear considering key farming time?
...Which really depends on your EXP per Hour while doing certain GRifts, which is why so many people value that information.
......And is also dependent on the quality of the GRift itself, thus has to be calculated over a longer period of time.
Or do GRift 55 at 10 minutes per clear considering key farming time?
Or do GRift 50 at 6 Minutes per clear considering key farming time?
...Which really depends on your EXP per Hour while doing certain GRifts, which is why so many people value that information.
......And is also dependent on the quality of the GRift itself, thus has to be calculated over a longer period of time.
...Then compare this to your setup where you're farming a Rift for a GRift key, then a GRift key, and how often you have a Pool of Reflection active, on average, which should account for your deaths in GRifts.
At the end of that wall of text, I must again point out my objective, which is to seek out your own.
You're saying that you're not saving much time by switching to a speed build for key farming. I think everyone's mileage will vary. Either way, you're saying that it's not as important to be efficient farming keys, which places more weight on the GRift level, clear time and EXP/hr in the GRift... So why not just go off of GRift EXP/hr as we do already? If Rift Key farm time isn't important, then why include it in your calculation?
Are we trying to create an arbitrary metric for the sake of being good at that metric? Are we creating a new "Rift + GRift + Pool + No Pickup + No Death + GRift-Gear-Only, Sustained XP/hr/day" measurement?
At the end of the day isn't it all about your GRift EXP/hr even during your calculation?
Want to add pools? Add a flat percentage and say "This is my EXP/hr with Pools, this is my EXP/hr without."
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serenevisage
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You get stuck with the 30 second wait time between regular rifts whether or not you're doing them all at once (dedicated key farming) or weaving them in between Grifts. The metric I am trying to measure is total XP gained over a sustained timeline, i.e. "what is the total XP that you gain every week you bot, taking into account all activities that you are automating or manually doing to prepare the bot". There is also some intrinsic value in not having to monitor or prepare the bot (personal time you can be doing other things in life), thus my "set it up for maximum afk-ability" goal. Each person values their time differently. I think it'd be interesting to have people track the actual amount of time they spend interfacing with their D3 bot over the course of a week, but good luck getting people to meticulously log that for science.
By far the biggest thing you lose by doing dedicated separate key farm and Grift sessions is the 25% bonus XP pool. The first time your bot dies in a Grift that 25% bonus is gone for the remainder of the session. If you're running a bot that never dies, you're probably not pushing the appropriate Grift level that would maximize your potential sustained XP. Increasing the Grift level to the point where you're occasionally (once every 1-3 hours) dying means that you're probably getting much better XP inside those Grifts... likely on the order of ~35% (+4 GR level). Could I be super safe and drop it those 3-4 GR levels and have my bot virtually never die? Yeah. But then I'm just making a null value tradeoff.
By setting the bot loose on an alternating Rift/Grift cycle, you don't have to invest any personal time in messing with the bot (or manually) gathering pools. You can push a higher Grift level and not worry about the bot dying and losing the 25% bonus, because it's very likely to recover that pool in the next regular Rift it runs and it's back running at peak efficiency.
So then we're left with the question of "how much more efficient is a speed key farming build than a Grift-tuned build that is asked to farm keys?" Depends totally on class and spec. The WW Barb build we've been discussing blows through regular rifts with incredible speed, because it has the most important attribute for speed key farming: high move speed. Not the fastest move speed possible in game, but effectively pretty close. Other builds (chicken doc) are also good at speed key farming, but they can't be turned around and used for Grifts as well.
I didn't specify whether or not to pick up mats; that is a personal choice. I was simply curious to see what XP/H people were getting when running a sustained Rift+Grift cycled bot pattern. We have a poster in this thread who is advertising ~45-48B XPH doing this... I challenge you to meticulously track all in-game time for your separate botting activities (key farming, pool farming, and Grifting) and beat that number with the calculated average XPH of those combined. The loss of the 25% bonus inside Grifts after your first death is just too high to overcome, and if you're checking your bot every hour to see if it died and then going to get more pools, you're spending a fuckload of personal time "playing" this game inefficiently. At that point you might as well just play manually, get a good group, run speed XP Grifts, and rake in 250-400B XPH for a few hours a day, eh?
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