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Windows 7 VS 8 for running bot

B

bloodmarks

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Hi,
Currently in VMWARE workstation 9 i am running some windows 7 (HB+WOW) instances, i am currently installing new instances, and I was thinking to use Windows 8 for them (main reason being that Windows 8 reduced memory needed per installation for windows itself from 500MB to 250MB so more windows/HB/WOW instances can be run with same amount of memory)

before i do this i have several concerns i would like answered from someone having used windows 8+HB:

- i read that windows 8+HB requires DX11 instead of DX9 in WOW and i am worried is it less stable than DX9, i am not sure is this still the case because thread date was from last year

- I am also worried DX11 will use more GPU power/memory than DX9 because WOW renders more in DX11 mode, did anyone do some benchmarks (all minimal details off course but since WOW DX11 is using different path i am worried it uses more GPU that way even on minimal details)?

- One more problem is that in windows 8 you can't disable desktop composition so i am worried windows itself would use more GPU resources, is it possible to disable desktop composition and still run HB/WOW normally like in windows 7?

- I was thinking to assign 1GB memory limit to one instance of windows 8 32bit+HB+WOW 32bit instead 2GB i have set on my windows 7 64bit+HB+WOW 32bit instances, do you see any problems with this?

Thanks,
Bloodmarks
 
randomstraw said:
Windows XP imo.
Click to expand...

do you have any numbers for windows XP running in VMWARE as in memory used, and CPU used, compared to windows 7/windows 8

also Windows XP is EOL that means it will be harder and harder finding drivers for GPU/motherboard/SATA3, WOW might stop supporting it/honorbuddy might not fix bug that only windows XP users see, anyway how much ram does windows XP with nothing started use? is it less or more than windows 8 250MB?
 
rcadams said:
People still use windows7? Really?
Click to expand...

Windows 8 is not that popular, they've gotten lots of crap for their big and annoying decisions.

For the thread, I have no clue who said that Windows 8 does not work with Dx9 for WoW. It most certainly does because if it didn't then my computer is seriously lying to me. You can disable the DWM but it's a piece of work, however with the removal of transparency I don't believe it uses hardly any GPU. It would also be easier to just get rid of Metro and all of that; it's a very fast and clean OS. However by default windows 8 will suck up lots of memory and disk space (if it can) for virtual memory and some other thing I forgot the name of. Easy to turn off, but 1 gig of memory for running all of that might be pushing it.

You could simply just torrent the OS and test it for yourself if you're planning on buying (if not I don't judge). I install it without the CD, just the files and it restarts and all of that just fine.
 
Last edited:
Liferose said:
For the thread, I have no clue who said that Windows 8 does not work with Dx9 for WoW. It most certainly does because if it didn't then my computer is seriously lying to me.
Click to expand...

http://www.thebuddyforum.com/honorbuddy-forum/honorbuddy-support/68951-windows-8-dx9.html
off course thread is old as i said that is main reason i am asking for opinions here because i suspected info i found is out of date

Liferose said:
You can disable the DWM but it's a piece of work, however with the removal of transparency I don't believe it uses hardly any GPU.
Click to expand...
I know it does not use much memory but i am worried since i plan to run 50+ virtual machines with WOW at same time on same PC that even that small amount adds up, on Windows 7 i just turned off 3D desktop effects and GPU usage while playing WOW did drop, and on Windows 8 you cant do that (as far as i know)

Liferose said:
It would also be easier to just get rid of Metro and all of that; it's a very fast and clean OS. However by default windows 8 will suck up lots of memory and disk space (if it can) for virtual memory and some other thing I forgot the name of. Easy to turn off, but 1 gig of memory for running all of that might be pushing it.
Click to expand...

than maybe leave it on 2GB and let VMWARE "ballooning driver" reclaim as much memory as possible?

Liferose said:
You could simply just torrent the OS and test it for yourself if you're planning on buying (if not I don't judge). I install it without the CD, just the files and it restarts and all of that just fine.
Click to expand...
I have both Windows 7 and Windows 8, I just wanted experience of some botter doing VMWARE with a lot of instances on performance

installing windows 7/windows 8 is not problem, but i will have to spend additional time after optimizing it/disabling services/unneeded parts of OS/address randomization (DEP/whatever makes VMWARE unable to share duplicate memory between virtual machines) and that can eat significant amounts of time since unlike installation you have to do it manually step by step (windows installation takes 1 minute to enter all options and then you can watch movie while its done)
 
bloodmarks said:
than maybe leave it on 2GB and let VMWARE "ballooning driver" reclaim as much memory as possible?

I have both Windows 7 and Windows 8, I just wanted experience of some botter doing VMWARE with a lot of instances on performance

installing windows 7/windows 8 is not problem, but i will have to spend additional time after optimizing it/disabling services/unneeded parts of OS/address randomization (DEP/whatever makes VMWARE unable to share duplicate memory between virtual machines) and that can eat significant amounts of time since unlike installation you have to do it manually step by step (windows installation takes 1 minute to enter all options and then you can watch movie while its done)
Click to expand...

  • I do not use VMWare for botting, as I simply make private profiles for people. This would be a question for someone more technically inclined, but I'm guessing it wouldn't be a problem as Win8 should use less memory regardless.
  • Windows 8 will give technically a marginal performance upgrade. I would test them out and see if you can get Windows 8 to a resource limited area that you like an make an image for it and copy it to the other VMWares if you like it. If it ends up being too much work you probably wouldn't go wrong with Win7 anyway.
 
Windows 8 Pro x64 MCE edition with DX9 on WoW, runs fine here.
I have the occasional [!299] memory error that I didn't have with Windows Vista (which I had before), but with every update it seems to run better.
 
LiquidAtoR said:
Windows 8 Pro x64 MCE edition with DX9 on WoW, runs fine here.
Click to expand...
great to hear DX9 is working fine with honorbuddy, i see you use x64 edition instead of x32, i was torn between x32 and x64 since x32 uses a bit less memory, but x64 has more registers to work with so windows should work few percent faster.

can you tell me for your (i assume clean with only windows/HB/WOW and no other games) windows 8 VM how much memory it takes
- while WOW/HB are not working so only windows is working
- while WOW and HB are working, standing in stormwind (environment with a lot of objects)
- while WOW and HB are working standing in valley of four winds (environment with low objects/usual herbing/mining environment, you don't have to actually herb/mine/ do anything, just stand there with bot started.

please don't forget any memory counted as "cache" in windows is actually free memory not used


edit:
DX9 is working fine with honorbuddy
i meant
DX9 is working fine with honorbuddy using windows 8 since i read HB on windows 8 requires DX11
 
bloodmarks said:
Hi,
Currently in VMWARE workstation 9 i am running some windows 7 (HB+WOW) instances, i am currently installing new instances, and I was thinking to use Windows 8 for them (main reason being that Windows 8 reduced memory needed per installation for windows itself from 500MB to 250MB so more windows/HB/WOW instances can be run with same amount of memory)

before i do this i have several concerns i would like answered from someone having used windows 8+HB:

- i read that windows 8+HB requires DX11 instead of DX9 in WOW and i am worried is it less stable than DX9, i am not sure is this still the case because thread date was from last year

- I am also worried DX11 will use more GPU power/memory than DX9 because WOW renders more in DX11 mode, did anyone do some benchmarks (all minimal details off course but since WOW DX11 is using different path i am worried it uses more GPU that way even on minimal details)?

- One more problem is that in windows 8 you can't disable desktop composition so i am worried windows itself would use more GPU resources, is it possible to disable desktop composition and still run HB/WOW normally like in windows 7?

- I was thinking to assign 1GB memory limit to one instance of windows 8 32bit+HB+WOW 32bit instead 2GB i have set on my windows 7 64bit+HB+WOW 32bit instances, do you see any problems with this?

Thanks,
Bloodmarks
Click to expand...


- I'm running HB on Windows 8 in a few VMware 9 sessions (DX9), without a glitch.
- That answers your second remark - no need for DX11, so no worries.
- Under Win8 you still can change the visual effects to "best performance".. that will save you a few clock-cycles. And also minimize the graphic settings in WoW.
- I would suggest to use 2GB per session. My sessions typically use 1.8GB each. But I'm running everything on Win8-64, that eats up slightly more memory than 32 bits.

I hope that answers your questions a bit.

Happy botting :)
 
Aetheric said:
- I'm running HB on Windows 8 in a few VMware 9 sessions (DX9), without a glitch.
- That answers your second remark - no need for DX11, so no worries.
- Under Win8 you still can change the visual effects to "best performance".. that will save you a few clock-cycles. And also minimize the graphic settings in WoW.
- I would suggest to use 2GB per session. My sessions typically use 1.8GB each. But I'm running everything on Win8-64, that eats up slightly more memory than 32 bits.

I hope that answers your questions a bit.

Happy botting :)
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot, you actually answered all my questions
 
Win8 cause have optimized core and better stability , and i have no problems with HBRelog + HB ;)
 
Windows 8

Anyone that cries about Windows 8 doesn't use 'Classic Shell'

It's exactly like Windows 7 except faster and more efficient
 
I prefer personally not bot wise Windows 7 over Windows 8. Of course if i could choose any OS it would be Win XP. Currently have 1 PC running Win 7 and other win 8 and both work fine for me.
 
I run bots on two different computers. 1 with windows 7 and 1 with windows 8. There are zero differences when it comes to botting. Picking either or is just personal preference on the OS.
 
Hallface said:
I run bots on two different computers. 1 with windows 7 and 1 with windows 8. There are zero differences when it comes to botting. Picking either or is just personal preference on the OS.
Click to expand...

just to check, do you run 1 bot on 1 computer 1 on other, or do you run several virtual machines with bot on 1 computer and several more on another

if you are running more than one windows+WOW+HB on each please answer these questions:
- do you use 32bit windows 7 or 64bit
- do you use 32bit windows 8 or 64bit
- VMWARE, or some other virtualization platform, or run them directly
- how many MBs of memory one instance of windows+WOW+HB uses on windows 7
- how many MBs of memory one instance of windows+WOW+HB uses on windows 8
- how many MBs of memory one instance of windows 7 (without WOW or HB started) uses
- how many MBs of memory one instance of windows 8 (without WOW or HB started) uses
- did you optimize windows 7/8 for virtual machine by disabling unneeded services/file time update and other things recommended in VMware manual
- are both machines using same CPU and same GPU
- when you start same number of machines on each computer (one windows 7 other windows 8) do they use same total CPU percentage
- when you start same number of machines on each computer (one windows 7 other windows 8) do they use same total GPU percentage

Thanks a lot for info Hallface
 
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