Opinion of Scholar vs Whitemage Bot Performance?

[madeinchina85]

Hi all,

I was getting ready to level a healer, and was curious if someone more experienced is able to comment on the bots performance as whm vs sch? just wanted to make sure there isnt an overwhelming preference on one over the other before I level up one of the two (leaning scholar).

I see many recommendations to use magitek with excombat assist, so I'm assuming that hasnt changed. Has anyone noticed a significant bot performance difference between whitemage & scholar?


Thank you!

 

[newb23]

I personally prefer SCH over WHM, but when it comes to the bot and Magitek, once you get all of your values for healing set up, it does not matter which you choose to use, it runs both quite well.

On the ExCombatAssist however, I would not suggest using it, as the only "major" option it added was not a needed addition. (FrameLock) That being said, if you are not using that, the other options it allows can be nice.

Furthermore and finally, just today blasthoss released a new combat assist botbase that looks to have added all of the features the ExCombat did and more, and can be found here.

Good luck!

 

[Prodiniz]

Honestly, don't use a bot to heal in groups/raids you'll likely get everyone wiped. I'll explain more in sec. Using the bot to level with fatebot, etc is great though.

The difference between WHM and SCH healing methods is reactive and proactive respectively. Since a WHM only has pure healing spells (stone skin aside) it will always have to wait for damage to be done before initiating a heal. SCH, on the other hand uses it's Adloquium shields to mitigate incoming damage before the next attack. It's two different styles of play that have to be taken into account. Additionally, assuming equal gear, a whm will always perform better as a raid healer due to the type and potency of it's aoe spells.

That being said and imo, RB doesn't currently have the ability to perform optimally as a healing bot. It's sluggish and the routines are unable to anticipate incoming damage that needs to be healed virtually as the damage is received (i.e. Tank busters or numerous situations where you have to time a heal and move accordingly). This isn't to say you won't get people that will say "oh, well i used it in "X" fight and it was fine". Sure, I may have exaggerated when I said you'll get everyone wiped, but you'll be a bad healer. The difference between what RB is capable of doing and what a human can do in regards to healing is vast with RB on the losing end. The rotations for the dps classes, on the other hand, are amazing and far better than I can do on my own without serious concentration.

Currently, healing in FFXIV is not hard, but to be good it does require you to have knowledge of the fights and the ability to anticipate incoming damage, neither of which can RB currently provide. I would advise you use RB to fate to level 50, then learn your class and play manually until more/better features or routines are available.

 

[lotrodude]

I agree with everything stated above by Prodiniz, but I would like to add a few comments of personal opinion. Not disagreement, just perspective.
Paladins use a shield and Warriors do not.
In my opinion:
Warriors are better at dealing dmg and better at running 4 man dungeons.
Paladins are better at taking dmg (dmg mitigation) and necessary for end game raids.
Scholars provide better shielding and are better for healing Warriors.
White Mages provide better healing and are better suited for healing Paladins in end game raids.

 

[Prodiniz]

Scholars provide better shielding and are better for healing Warriors.
White Mages provide better healing and are better suited for healing Paladins in end game raids.

I appreciate you giving me props in your opener and being non-confrontational, but just have to strongly disagree with these two statements.

As someone who mained healer for the first year and half of this game (no bot), T1-5 WHM, T6-9 SCH (backup WHM), T10-13 BRD/NIN/SCH, I can tell you this is just simply incorrect. Sorry if it sounds harsh, I don't mean it like that or to be offensive, but I've seen the reddit theorycrafts topics and the general chit chat in game about this and it's just garbage.

If anything, it's exactly the opposite.
Because a PLD has higher damage mitigation it benefits longer from Adloquium shields and at the same time because it DOES take less damage it allows the SCH to use it's lower potency and MP heals to make up the difference in a more evenly manner. This also allows the SCH to reserve Aether stacks for assisted dps uses like Bane and Energy Drain and the occasional Lustrate for tank busters or dire situations.

Meanwhile, a WAR takes more damage consistently but gets an increase to hp healed which is directly complimented by a WHMs healing potency and Regen making it more likely to maintain even healing and less likely to overheal. Even a WHMs CD abilities like Presence of Mind and Divine Seal work seamlessly with the way a WAR needs to be healed in times of duress. And again, because of the way they work well together a WHM can lose minimal momentum in it's ability to contribute to the party dps-wise.

But all of that is moot and an improper way to evaluate their abilities, imo. It should be looked at by how each class fills it's role in different ways using different strategies/playstyles. Like I said in my previous post WHMs are REactive healers and SCHs are PROactive healers. Both are capable of doing the same content, but they have to go about it differently and in some situations one is superior to the other. You will often find that SCH is the ideal single target healer and WHM is the superb raid healing monster.

 

[madeinchina85]

Hey thanks for the tips guys, this was helpful. I'll prob just bot up arcanist while i dungeon queue with conjurer. Level up whm first and learn the ropes and move from there. Thanks again!

 

[y2krazy]

Hey thanks for the tips guys, this was helpful. I'll prob just bot up arcanist while i dungeon queue with conjurer. Level up whm first and learn the ropes and move from there. Thanks again!

Don't forget to make use of this plugin:

https://www.thebuddyforum.com/rebor...plugin-dfalert-queue-monitor-duty-finder.html

Good luck!

 

[lotrodude]

I appreciate you giving me props in your opener and being non-confrontational, but just have to strongly disagree...

No argument from me. I was simply speaking from my limited experience of about 6 weeks. I still have a lot to learn about the game.

 

[Vira1]

The difference between WHM and SCH healing methods is reactive and proactive respectively. Since a WHM only has pure healing spells (stone skin aside) it will always have to wait for damage to be done before initiating a heal. SCH, on the other hand uses it's Adloquium shields to mitigate incoming damage before the next attack. It's two different styles of play that have to be taken into account. Additionally, assuming equal gear, a whm will always perform better as a raid healer due to the type and potency of it's aoe spells.

This is just blatantly incorrect. Every form of healing in FFXIV is proactive, your shields land before the attack goes off, and your heals land as the attack goes off. You never start healing after the damage is already done. The heal should be timed to land so the HP looks as if it didn't even move.

I kick any WHM from my groups if they heal reactively.

Scholars provide better shielding and are better for healing Warriors.
White Mages provide better healing and are better suited for healing Paladins in end game raids.

This isn't the case, in cases of high damage on both tanks and/or a pug group, the scholar should always be on the target taking the most significant portion of damage due to superior single target healing. This is usually the PLD. It also gives the WHM more time to focus on healing the raid.

Ideally the scholar will only mitigate + DPS and WHM will handle all healing but most players are bad outside of decent statics.

 

[Prodiniz]

This is just blatantly incorrect. Every form of healing in FFXIV is proactive, your shields land before the attack goes off, and your heals land as the attack goes off. You never start healing after the damage is already done. The heal should be timed to land so the HP looks as if it didn't even move.

You failed to understand what I was saying.

There is a difference in being a player that heals in proactive manor (precasting) and a class that heals proactively by design. Every healer, regardless of class, should heal proactively by knowing the fights and precasting heals/shields/mitigation/etc appropriately, but a SCH specifically is a proactive healing class because of the Adloquium shields that act as an extension of HP and are used to negate incoming damage without having to "precast" in the same sense. A WHM is reactive in the sense that aside from Stone Skin it cannot extend/buffer incoming damage. It can only heal damage that has already been applied to the target's base HP. It doesn't matter if the "HP looks as if it didn't even move", the fact is the damage was done first, then reactively healed.

I kick any WHM from my groups if they heal reactively.

I'm sorry to see that you are, by your own admission, so intolerant of those you deem beneath you. Maybe helping people understand better would make your server a nicer place.

 

[Vira1]

That information is freely available online with minimal effort, or with minimal experience playing the game, if they don't know a fight I will teach them, but if they blatantly put in no effort and expect other people to make up for it then I'll pass.

Reactive healers fit that category perfectly. If I kick them I tell them to look up how to play online.

 

[MasterKilj]

Sigh. Why is it wasted forum posts are starting to creep up in the routine page that has nothing to do with developing routines. Take your incessant bickering to the ff 14 healing forums.

 

[Vira1]

Sigh. Why is it wasted forum posts are starting to creep up in the routine page that has nothing to do with developing routines. Take your incessant bickering to the ff 14 healing forums. Ive seen turn 13 white mages perform just fine even if they did not time healing after mega flares if the heal lands 1-2 seconds later. The turns are balanced around having enough time to perform your heals after most aoe patterns and true timing your heals a split second after the ability hits works out better both will get the job done.

You just did what you told us not to do. GG.

 

[Prodiniz]

Sigh. Why is it wasted forum posts are starting to creep up in the routine page that has nothing to do with developing routines. Take your incessant bickering to the ff 14 healing forums.

WTH is your problem, Kilj? The OP specifically had questions regarding how CRs handled healing. We answered those questions, clarified what we were talking about and moved on almost 2 weeks ago (Vira last posted on 24.05.2015, 04:47). Not only did you just bump the topic you're complaining about....but you're also OT.....