Crowd funding idea and the toxic circumstances here.

[tsheltonx]

Is there any interest in setting up something on this page where we crowd fund these plugins that are considered necessities ( map runners etc ) so that we can have some semblance of continuity? This system where some guy makes a plugin we come to rely on and then he quits or dies and it goes stagnant really, really sucks. You end up with a 251 page shitshow thread and still don't have a clear cut upgrade. Map buddy and map runner are great examples. We need basic things fixed and the owners of the bot obviously have no interest in doing it. Most people that play this game over a week doesn't need the quest or grind bots for very long as good as they are. If we could start transparent projects on this site where someone educated on coding actually delivered the community as a whole would be in a much better situation with a lot of these plugins. Most of us are not coders and when most of us post some desperate, angry little nerd that has gotten little to no sunlight in the last year starts with this "wtf idiot? just fix it bro god you're such trash. you can't code? lolz". It's exactly like that retard office tech support guy from old SNL that ripped on people whenever they called him for support. This culture sucks and the map plugins definitely also suck at this point. We need a real solution with real structure. You'd think management would give some semblance of a shit because we pay a significant monthly, but apparently they don't and that fee is just for basic use.

Regardless of my delivery, you know I'm right.

If we could get a minor gofundme or something similar up with professionals that had actual transparency I think we could really cultivate what's available here by making it worthwhile for the people that know how to do it as well as the users. maybe that's not the path, but we need to opent he conversation again.

 

[clandestine]

The toxicity of this community comes from:

> I have a problem, it doesn't work

okay, we can't help you with that, please provide a log

> I pay for this bot, fix it

okay, we still can't help you with that, please provide a log

> but is not working! fix it!

log? please?

> posts a partial log

we need a full log

> fix it already!

... *gives up*


or

> it doesn't work, fix it!

your problem occured before, please read the thread to find the answer

> i don't wanna, spoonfeed me

...

--

If you go through that many, many times you simply stop giving a fuck and start insulting people. When you actually spend the time to try and help people you either get insane with the frustration of answering the same questions over and over again or you start amusing yourself by insulting and shitposting. I don't know how toNyx puts up with the amount of shitposts regarding AIF and people being too stupid to understand a) the game and b) not reading the AIF thread.

Then we have the people that promise to pay for help. How many of those have come through? I can tell you how many: 0. The only way it could work was with a patreon page, but even that I doubt would help much. Beacuse let's be honest, 99% of the people here are leeches and don't want to spend more money on top of the monthly sub to EB. Plus on top of that, with crowdfunded plugins, you'll repeat the cycle from above. "I'm paying money, fix my problem without me telling you what the problem is or posting a log".

To take it one step further, you yourself belong in that group. You had an issue, posted a partial log, and expected everyone to simply read your mind and know what your issue was. Even after asking specifically for a log, to this day you failed to provide one. Look at it from a developers point of view:

Something doesn't work, well shit, what now? Analyze the output of the program to either identify the issue or recreate the circumstances that lead to this issue. Without full information it's impossible for a dev to help anyone out, besides taking a shot in the dark and guessing. We want to help you out, but you have to help us help you by providing a full log of the problem. It's like calling your ISP complaining that you can't send/receive emails, and that they should fix it NOW while you didn't pay your bill and your internet was shut off.

 

[yfbd]

The toxicity of this community comes from:

> I have a problem, it doesn't work

okay, we can't help you with that, please provide a log

> I pay for this bot, fix it

okay, we still can't help you with that, please provide a log

> but is not working! fix it!

log? please?

> posts a partial log

we need a full log

> fix it already!

... *gives up*


or

> it doesn't work, fix it!

your problem occured before, please read the thread to find the answer

> i don't wanna, spoonfeed me

...

--

If you go through that many, many times you simply stop giving a fuck and start insulting people. When you actually spend the time to try and help people you either get insane with the frustration of answering the same questions over and over again or you start amusing yourself by insulting and shitposting. I don't know how toNyx puts up with the amount of shitposts regarding AIF and people being too stupid to understand a) the game and b) not reading the AIF thread.

Then we have the people that promise to pay for help. How many of those have come through? I can tell you how many: 0. The only way it could work was with a patreon page, but even that I doubt would help much. Beacuse let's be honest, 99% of the people here are leeches and don't want to spend more money on top of the monthly sub to EB. Plus on top of that, with crowdfunded plugins, you'll repeat the cycle from above. "I'm paying money, fix my problem without me telling you what the problem is or posting a log".

To take it one step further, you yourself belong in that group. You had an issue, posted a partial log, and expected everyone to simply read your mind and know what your issue was. Even after asking specifically for a log, to this day you failed to provide one. Look at it from a developers point of view:

Something doesn't work, well shit, what now? Analyze the output of the program to either identify the issue or recreate the circumstances that lead to this issue. Without full information it's impossible for a dev to help anyone out, besides taking a shot in the dark and guessing. We want to help you out, but you have to help us help you by providing a full log of the problem. It's like calling your ISP complaining that you can't send/receive emails, and that they should fix it NOW while you didn't pay your bill and your internet was shut off.

Now I understand what some of the devs feel, especially that jackass darkbluefirefly.

 

[stealthy]

Is there any interest in setting up something on this page where we crowd fund these plugins that are considered necessities ( map runners etc ) so that we can have some semblance of continuity? This system where some guy makes a plugin we come to rely on and then he quits or dies and it goes stagnant really, really sucks. You end up with a 251 page shitshow thread and still don't have a clear cut upgrade. Map buddy and map runner are great examples. We need basic things fixed and the owners of the bot obviously have no interest in doing it. Most people that play this game over a week doesn't need the quest or grind bots for very long as good as they are. If we could start transparent projects on this site where someone educated on coding actually delivered the community as a whole would be in a much better situation with a lot of these plugins. Most of us are not coders and when most of us post some desperate, angry little nerd that has gotten little to no sunlight in the last year starts with this "wtf idiot? just fix it bro god you're such trash. you can't code? lolz". It's exactly like that retard office tech support guy from old SNL that ripped on people whenever they called him for support. This culture sucks and the map plugins definitely also suck at this point. We need a real solution with real structure. You'd think management would give some semblance of a shit because we pay a significant monthly, but apparently they don't and that fee is just for basic use.

Regardless of my delivery, you know I'm right.

If we could get a minor gofundme or something similar up with professionals that had actual transparency I think we could really cultivate what's available here by making it worthwhile for the people that know how to do it as well as the users. maybe that's not the path, but we need to opent he conversation again.

I think you're underestimating how much professional software devs make. We work on these community projects for the fun of it and to make something better, not for the pay.

I think Clandestine has otherwise summed it up fairly well - it meshes closely with my experiences during my time with StealthBot.

Edit: I understand where you're coming from and I'm somewhat guilty of similar in how I disappeared from LavishNet and abandoned StealthBot when making some career moves and losing free time. That's why I've been trying to make sure I have any plugins I work on available in Git, so anyone can pick up where I leave off should I disappear again. It's not perfect, but it's a lot better than what has been happening.

 

[darkbluefirefly]

Is there any interest in setting up something on this page where we crowd fund these plugins that are considered necessities ( map runners etc ) so that we can have some semblance of continuity? This system where some guy makes a plugin we come to rely on and then he quits or dies and it goes stagnant really, really sucks. You end up with a 251 page shitshow thread and still don't have a clear cut upgrade. Map buddy and map runner are great examples. We need basic things fixed and the owners of the bot obviously have no interest in doing it. Most people that play this game over a week doesn't need the quest or grind bots for very long as good as they are. If we could start transparent projects on this site where someone educated on coding actually delivered the community as a whole would be in a much better situation with a lot of these plugins. Most of us are not coders and when most of us post some desperate, angry little nerd that has gotten little to no sunlight in the last year starts with this "wtf idiot? just fix it bro god you're such trash. you can't code? lolz". It's exactly like that retard office tech support guy from old SNL that ripped on people whenever they called him for support. This culture sucks and the map plugins definitely also suck at this point. We need a real solution with real structure. You'd think management would give some semblance of a shit because we pay a significant monthly, but apparently they don't and that fee is just for basic use.

Regardless of my delivery, you know I'm right.

If we could get a minor gofundme or something similar up with professionals that had actual transparency I think we could really cultivate what's available here by making it worthwhile for the people that know how to do it as well as the users. maybe that's not the path, but we need to opent he conversation again.

Someone's mad that the nerd is making more money then he is. Jealousy isn't a nice thing especially when you have literally nothing to offer at the table.
Isn't it sad that the angry little nerd is making plugins that you need? Aren't you a little ashamed that the angry little nerd has so much control over if you can properly bot or not?
Man you just painted a huge, i'm not going to give a dam about what tsheltonx says from now on, mentality for com devs. GL with that mentality.
P.S. 99% of com devs do this for fun, 1% the top 1% do this for profits. And if you think that someone who is paying for 50 EB keys a month is going to suddenly help you be successful after they have spent years trying to be successful, you shouldn't be calling other kids, but look at the mirror and use that word on yourself.

 

[clandestine]

btw tsheltonx, since Map Runner and Map Buddy suck so much according to your post, why don't you go ahead and write a new better plugin than what we have? Oh you don't have time to learn C# and/or coding? Well, do you think everyone that can code was paid to learn or did they learn it for themselves in their freetime? Buckle down, you've got the internet at your fingertips, it's easy to learn. But as you said, you don't have time, you'd rather wink with your money and pay someone to do it.

Well, here's the deal, put up 5'000€/$/whatevercurrency in escrow and have someone write a new Mapping plugin. What, you want to that plugin for yourself then? No, that's not how this works.

 

[Gentoo]

Now I understand what some of the devs feel, especially that jackass darkbluefirefly.

The grocery boy?

 

[darkbluefirefly]

The grocery boy?

Wow finally crawled out of hat cave I see. Thanks for taking me with such importance that one of your 2 post in forever has to be about me. Shows how important I am to you.

 

[tsheltonx]

These are precisely the types of unprofessional and holier than thou responses I was talking about. I'll reiterate for all of us that don't spend our lives at a desk.

I'm not a coder. I have no interest in becoming one. I have every right to not only not understand coding, but to not expect that I have to start spending hours researching how to fix minor issues that a professional with a professional attitude could address for what is a very large community in much less time.

Look at all of the vitriol in your replies. Do I get frustrated? Of course. Do Map Buddy and Map Runner work? They do, they barely deliver at this point. If you don't believe me, check out one of the 300 page threads. It's not our job as customers to troubleshoot the majority of the issues. People have to go to school for coding for a reason.

The concept that map running utilities are some type of perk for a POE bot is absurd considering that maps make up the entirety of the end game. If you don't care about that because you farm and sell POE currency at low levels, that's fine. It also makes you complete loser, period. Farming currency in a video game will neither develop you as a human nor get you laid outside of hookers. Frankly, it's one of the most pathetic careers I can think of, if you can even call it one. That's why low income, Chinese college kids do it in dorms, because those are the types of lowlife circumstances that warrant such an embarrassing and pathetic gig. So save your little high horses for people that don't know what you really are. You make money in pennies and you do it in an unhealthy environment.

Anyway, this is an exceptional program but both map utilities have a variety of disappointing issues because they haven't been upkept. Someone needs to take the wheel. If the admins here don't have the right attitudes or feel responsible for helping with something we all consider a staple, so be it. We need someone who can.

 

[yfbd]

These are precisely the types of unprofessional and holier than thou responses I was talking about. I'll reiterate for all of us that don't spend our lives at a desk.

I'm not a coder. I have no interest in becoming one. I have every right to not only not understand coding, but to not expect that I have to start spending hours researching how to fix minor issues that a professional with a professional attitude could address for what is a very large community in much less time.

Look at all of the vitriol in your replies. Do I get frustrated? Of course. Do Map Buddy and Map Runner work? They do, they barely deliver at this point. If you don't believe me, check out one of the 300 page threads. It's not our job as customers to troubleshoot the majority of the issues. People have to go to school for coding for a reason.

The concept that map running utilities are some type of perk for a POE bot is absurd considering that maps make up the entirety of the end game. If you don't care about that because you farm and sell POE currency at low levels, that's fine. It also makes you complete loser, period. Farming currency in a video game will neither develop you as a human nor get you laid outside of hookers. Frankly, it's one of the most pathetic careers I can think of, if you can even call it one. That's why low income, Chinese college kids do it in dorms, because those are the types of lowlife circumstances that warrant such an embarrassing and pathetic gig. So save your little high horses for people that don't know what you really are. You make money in pennies and you do it in an unhealthy environment.

Anyway, this is an exceptional program but both map utilities have a variety of disappointing issues because they haven't been upkept. Someone needs to take the wheel. If the admins here don't have the right attitudes or feel responsible for helping with something we all consider a staple, so be it. We need someone who can.

Rofl. Someone needs their meds.

1. Read the exilebuddy purchase page again. Now does it do all it says. Yes it does. Is mapping part of that? No, is questing, No.
2. Things people do on their own time, is thier own time. You have absolutely no right to demand anything, it's free. You paid for the platform, not com dev's work.
3. If you have no interest in programming, and start demanding people who are doing it on their own free time, do things you want. It shows your ignorance to the fact that you're, I hate say it, a little kid with this post, crying because you cannot get your way.
4. The concept that buddy is a platform, and you are paying for the platform, has and always be there. I'm not speaking on behalf of buddy, staff, I'm speaking from my observations with All buddy products.
5.

Farming currency in a video game will neither develop you as a human nor get you laid outside of hookers. Frankly, it's one of the most pathetic careers I can think of, if you can even call it one. That's why low income, Chinese college kids do it in dorms, because those are the types of lowlife circumstances that warrant such an embarrassing and pathetic gig. So save your little high horses for people that don't know what you really are. You make money in pennies and you do it in an unhealthy environment.

I don't even know what you are thinking. Why the hell are you complaining then? You just described yourself. Idiot.
You're the one buying buddy products to farm, you're the one complaining, you're the one calling the people who can code nerds. So what do you really want? because at this point, it seems like all the negative shit that you've pent up inside because of your ignorance is spilling out, and you're trying to vent. It's not working bud.

6.

Someone needs to take the wheel. If the admins here don't have the right attitudes or feel responsible for helping with something we all consider a staple, so be it. We need someone who can.

Who is We? You just said,

I'm not a coder. I have no interest in becoming one

, what the hell are you on??

It's like Logic and common sense doesn't work with you.

 

[poiuytrewq]

These are precisely the types of unprofessional and holier than thou responses I was talking about. I'll reiterate for all of us that don't spend our lives at a desk.

I'm not a coder. I have no interest in becoming one. I have every right to not only not understand coding, but to not expect that I have to start spending hours researching how to fix minor issues that a professional with a professional attitude could address for what is a very large community in much less time.

I get it. Because you are better than everyone else here we HAVE to help you because you don't want to put any effort in. The bot doesn't need hours of research like you claim. If you get an error and it takes you hours to fix it then it's not the community's fault, it's not the dev's fault, it's only your fault. The default bot works great and that's what you paid for, nothing else. If you don't think the default bot has enough features or isn't stable enough then don't just don't buy it instead of making a post whining about how the bot isn't up to your standards.

The default bot works without ANY problem and so does every plugin I have tried on this forum. If something isn't to my liking then I just go into the code and adjust it (most plugins have very easy to follow code, if you don't understand it then you have many more problems than not being able to run the bot). I have zero programming experience btw. If you think you need it to edit text files then you're just lazy.

It's not our job as customers to troubleshoot the majority of the issues.

I would love for you to give me a specific issue that you are having with the bot.

If you don't care about that because you farm and sell POE currency at low levels, that's fine. It also makes you complete loser, period. Farming currency in a video game will neither develop you as a human nor get you laid outside of hookers. Frankly, it's one of the most pathetic careers I can think of, if you can even call it one. That's why low income, Chinese college kids do it in dorms, because those are the types of lowlife circumstances that warrant such an embarrassing and pathetic gig. So save your little high horses for people that don't know what you really are. You make money in pennies and you do it in an unhealthy environment.

Sounds like you have some deep rooted physiological problems. Please don't take out your anger on people who are more successful than you.

 

[clandestine]

These are precisely the types of unprofessional and holier than thou responses I was talking about. I'll reiterate for all of us that don't spend our lives at a desk.

*grabs popcorn*

I'm not a coder. I have no interest in becoming one. I have every right to not only not understand coding, but to not expect that I have to start spending hours researching how to fix minor issues that a professional with a professional attitude could address for what is a very large community in much less time.

As I said a few posts back, the "professionals" are open to help you, but if you fail to follow the instructions they provide (posting a full log for example) why should they spend extra time trying to help you when there are many others that have an issue and follow what they are asked to provide? Again, you attack the people here that are trying to help people, and you're driving them away with your "I'm entitled to everything" attitude.

Look at all of the vitriol in your replies. Do I get frustrated? Of course. Do Map Buddy and Map Runner work? They do, they barely deliver at this point. If you don't believe me, check out one of the 300 page threads. It's not our job as customers to troubleshoot the majority of the issues. People have to go to school for coding for a reason.

They work, and they work well. Again, because they don't work for you as you imagine they should work doesn't mean they're crap. MapBuddy has been discontinued from the looks of it, it's still there for people to use but anyone with a grain of common sense would know that a discontinued plugin will have issues. Are there things MapRunner could do better? Yes, that's why MapBot is in the works by ExVault. Now since a paid dev is working on MapBot, why should any of the community devs start work on yet another mapping plugin? Why don't you elaborate on what exactly your issues with MapBuddy and/or MapRunner are? You just spew and rant without providing any information on what your problem is. Sorry we still can't read your mind.

The concept that map running utilities are some type of perk for a POE bot is absurd considering that maps make up the entirety of the end game. If you don't care about that because you farm and sell POE currency at low levels, that's fine. It also makes you complete loser, period. Farming currency in a video game will neither develop you as a human nor get you laid outside of hookers. Frankly, it's one of the most pathetic careers I can think of, if you can even call it one. That's why low income, Chinese college kids do it in dorms, because those are the types of lowlife circumstances that warrant such an embarrassing and pathetic gig. So save your little high horses for people that don't know what you really are. You make money in pennies and you do it in an unhealthy environment.

sigh.. with this alone you've earned a permanent spot on everyones shitlist. so please, go die in a fire or take your fucking meds. If you're not on meds, go talk to a shrink.

Anyway, this is an exceptional program but both map utilities have a variety of disappointing issues because they haven't been upkept. Someone needs to take the wheel. If the admins here don't have the right attitudes or feel responsible for helping with something we all consider a staple, so be it. We need someone who can.

Why is it the admins fault? They provide a stable base for community devs to work on. They deliver exactly what is promised, nothing more nothing less (well, a bit more, quetsbot and the upcoming mapbot).

 

[DontBeAfraid]

***

 

[eatinapineapple]

It's like Logic and common sense doesn't work with you.

I mean he did just say he wasn't a coder...